You are currently viewing HCRealms.com, The Premier HeroClix Community, as a Guest. If you would like to participate in the community, please Register to join the discussion!
If you are having problems registering to an account, feel free to Contact Us.
Justice League T002 and SOG 001 Oracle + theme team prob
Hello,
Can I use Oracle SP to place the JL team base.Then through the working together ability move the JL team base?
I'm not certain but I say yes.As the power of Oracle is not the same game effect as Working together.
Here's Oracle SP
Quote
MOVING THE PIECES INTO PLACE: Give Oracle a power action and choose another friendly character that shares a keyword with her and has no action tokens. That character is immediately given a move action as a free action with their speed value halved for this action.
There you have the description of a Team Base ability
Quote
WORKING TOGETHER: Give this character a power action and it may be given one action as a free action for every 100 points or fraction thereof of its point value.These free actions may be used for any action,but you may only give a character up to 1 move action,up to 1 power action,up to 1 close combat action and up to 1 ranged combat action.Any number of these free actions may be used to make either a close or ranged combat attack
2013 Rulebook page 9.
Quote
A character may not activate the same game effect twice in one turn with free actions, unless the game effect indicates otherwise.
Second question Booster Gold from the Batman set is in a keyworded 300 point force with Martian Manhunter from the Brave and the Bold.
During my opponent's turn I want to use theme prob with Booster to reroll my opponents attack roll.
Booster has already one token.Using themed team prob would push Booster,who will gain prob control through his damage SP.
What comes first : the use of themed team PC or the token?
1) Oracle's power is a Free Move Action, it is not placement.
2) Theme Team Probability Control's effects will happen first then the token. Pushing Damage happens as actions resolve.
Quote : Originally Posted by Necromagus
When I came on board as RA I brought with me a mission to meet the intent of a power/ability and a firm distaste for exploits or loopholes that circumvented the intention of a rule. That's where the Rules team comes in.
Thanks for your reply
Sorry I didn't notice my mistake.
The Halved free movement allowed through oracle's SP and the free movement allowed through team base working together are considered to be the same game effect?
Thanks for your reply
Sorry I didn't notice my mistake.
The Halved free movement allowed through oracle's SP and the free movement allowed through team base working together are considered to be the same game effect?
Working together would make the Move action a free action, and Oracles power also makes it a free action.
As you said you can't be given the same free action more than once.
"The greatest harm can result from the best intentions."
-Nathan Rahl My Trade Thread
Actually upon more reading, I am beginning to doubt myself. At first they are both free actions... however
Quote
WORKING TOGETHER: Give this character a power action and it may be given one action as a free action for every 100 points or fraction thereof of its point value.
Makes me think it would allow you to do so, as long as Oracle came first. Purely because this specifically says you are allowed to do as many free actions as you want, up to the Team Bases points... taking justice league for example it can reach 600 points. Thus, being allowed to do 6 free actions. The only thing that limits you is the rest of the power...
Quote
These free actions may be used for any action,but you may only give a character up to 1 move action,up to 1 power action,up to 1 close combat action and up to 1 ranged combat action.Any number of these free actions may be used to make either a close or ranged combat attack
I may be stretching for something, but it may actually work. I have no idea now.
"The greatest harm can result from the best intentions."
-Nathan Rahl My Trade Thread
The problem is that the prohibition is against activating the same game effect multiple times with free actions. A move action is a game effect, and so is (for example) Phasing/Teleport. I believe that the restriction is usually applied to the result of the action rather than the type, so a move action to use P/T and one to simply move should be OK. Two to use P/T would not be, nor would two to simply move.
I can explain it to you, but I can't understand it for you.
“No matter how subtle the wizard, a knife between the shoulder blades will seriously cramp his style.”
The problem is that the prohibition is against activating the same game effect multiple times with free actions. A move action is a game effect, and so is (for example) Phasing/Teleport. I believe that the restriction is usually applied to the result of the action rather than the type, so a move action to use P/T and one to simply move should be OK. Two to use P/T would not be, nor would two to simply move.
And I agree fully, however you can do multiples of the same action if you are allowed to be the power. Flurry as an example.
Working together allows you to be given as many actions, as free actions as your total build of your Team Base. However, in a later sentence you are limited to 1 action of each type.
That is where I am not sure, it may be that since Oracle gave them a free move action that they would not be able to use another Free action, move action since they are limited.
But, they can be allowed to use more Actions as free actions than they could actually do since 1 of each type results in only 4 actions.
I assume you can't since they are both free actions, but Working Together is technically allowed to do as many free actions as their team base build total allows.
"The greatest harm can result from the best intentions."
-Nathan Rahl My Trade Thread
And I agree fully, however you can do multiples of the same action if you are allowed to be the power. Flurry as an example.
Working together allows you to be given as many actions, as free actions as your total build of your Team Base. However, in a later sentence you are limited to 1 action of each type.
That is where I am not sure, it may be that since Oracle gave them a free move action that they would not be able to use another Free action, move action since they are limited.
But, they can be allowed to use more Actions as free actions than they could actually do since 1 of each type results in only 4 actions.
I assume you can't since they are both free actions, but Working Together is technically allowed to do as many free actions as their team base build total allows.
A couple of points though, although it lists the Actions you can do with Working Together, the only actions it allows to make multiple times is Close and Ranged Combat Attacks.
If Oracle gave them a Move Action as a Free Action to just move and then under Working Together the use Phasing/Teleport as a Free Action, that is perfectly fine.
Quote : Originally Posted by Necromagus
When I came on board as RA I brought with me a mission to meet the intent of a power/ability and a firm distaste for exploits or loopholes that circumvented the intention of a rule. That's where the Rules team comes in.
Flurry is ruled that, if you can start flurry, then you can 'finish' flurry by performing the free action to make a close combat attack. Flurry says you can do it, something allowed you to flurry, therefore it is legal, whether or not you already made a close combat attack as a free action.
Why wouldn't Working Together work that way?
Working Together says I can use one of my free actions as a move action, something allowed me to use Working Together, so why does it not allow me to break the, 'you were able to start it, you can finish it' rule?
This could also stem from the "if you start it, you can finish it" not being clearly defined.
Flurry is ruled that, if you can start flurry, then you can 'finish' flurry by performing the free action to make a close combat attack. Flurry says you can do it, something allowed you to flurry, therefore it is legal, whether or not you already made a close combat attack as a free action.
Why wouldn't Working Together work that way?
Working Together says I can use one of my free actions as a move action, something allowed me to use Working Together, so why does it not allow me to break the, 'you were able to start it, you can finish it' rule?
This could also stem from the "if you start it, you can finish it" not being clearly defined.
It is saying you can use the actions for any actions, which is more similar to Multi-Attack. The difference is that Multi-Attack specifically states it can be used to activate the same effects, while Working Together states that only for the Ranged and Close Combat Attacks. The rest are just up to 1 action each, but nothing saying they can break the rule.
Quote : Originally Posted by Necromagus
When I came on board as RA I brought with me a mission to meet the intent of a power/ability and a firm distaste for exploits or loopholes that circumvented the intention of a rule. That's where the Rules team comes in.
Flurry is ruled that, if you can start flurry, then you can 'finish' flurry by performing the free action to make a close combat attack. Flurry says you can do it, something allowed you to flurry, therefore it is legal, whether or not you already made a close combat attack as a free action.
Why wouldn't Working Together work that way?
Working Together says I can use one of my free actions as a move action, something allowed me to use Working Together, so why does it not allow me to break the, 'you were able to start it, you can finish it' rule?
This could also stem from the "if you start it, you can finish it" not being clearly defined.
The power actually says "up to one," which is different than a specific allowance such as Flurry. Working Together is telling you have X number of free actions, and then setting an upper limit on some specific options you might choose.
I can explain it to you, but I can't understand it for you.
“No matter how subtle the wizard, a knife between the shoulder blades will seriously cramp his style.”