I'd like to play Liao with some aspiration to faction purity in this scenario and NOT get slaughtered, so some mercs come into the picture. Here is my draft army:

Elite Targe (159)
Merc Balac (43)
Merc Sniper (58)
Merc Crow (27)
Minigun Cycle (12)
Total: 499

Other options: dump the choppers and take a Shun with a Fa Shih in it (same points), dump the targe for something smaller and take more infantry, dump the sniper for another chopper and then remove the cycle and put in a Merc Kanazuchi.

I don't think this is terribly strong, however. The Sniper can pop rounds off on the bogged-down bad guys, sure, but I have a sinking feeling that some folks will take SS Snipers and Toads and leisurely bombard my plateau, and then run Balacs up and crush me. With 400 points, you can lay out a large amount of SS smackdown. . . and I don't think Liao has the counterpunch to stand up to that.

So should I just abandon some sort of purity, or are there ways to work it?

Thoughts?

Slan,

i have thoughts, you can buy them at the front desk for a penny

Stay Faction Pure its the only way to go. I always go faction pure. If you dont go faction pure it takes away from the game in my opinion.

Hey nice start. If you want faction pure ideas check out the forums at the website in my signature.

I try to play faction pure Liao whenever I can. However in this scenario I will probably bring out the cheese to even the field. But I do have a lot of experience playing with faction pure liao. Unfortunately your army is not necessarily designed to make your opponent come to you. You do have the sniper but it has average range. Honestly I'd suggest two Liao DI Towed AA instead. If you play against SS pure you don;t have to worry about armor and the Di towed's can take a direct shot at their balacs. Even after one damage their balacs are less useful.

If you absolutely must play a mech than the Targe is good one. However you can also play the wasp and use the savings to run zahns with your toweds. The wasp is fast and can be a harasser. The Targe is a fighter not a harasser and in this scenario you'll lose in a stand-up fight since the enemy outnumbers you. If you don't have to play a mech then the Regulators make good bodyguards on the ridge.

Lastly, a Shun and Salamander give you the option of assaulting them if you have too. If for some reason your facing multiple SS Towed AA's and have to get their quick you'll be glad you got the Shun.

So here's a roster, all Liao pieces except where designated:

Wasp - 93 pts.
Di Towed AA Art x2 - 64 pts.
Zahn - 64 pts.
Shun - 44 pts.
Salamander - 25 pts.
Highlander peasants x2 -10 pts.

Total - 300 pts.

This army tries to harass and bomb. Mostly being all Liao their fanaticism will mean they stay around longer. Remember to visit the website in my sig. There's a lot of faction pure armies on the message boards there.

Xin Sheng!

First, a question: since artillery and VTOLS are on vehicle size bases will they suffer the firing penalties as described under the scenario? I hope so.

Second, is this scenario broken? That is, SS has a 400 point VC2 total, if nothing dies then SS wins! Who is trying to attack whom?

Third, what happens if the SS takes nothing but VTOLS? Yes, you might do a damage to a couple of them on the way in, but then, Ouch....

I've been fighting with myself on this one. I'm trying to design a nasty force for both sides. (SS is my 2nd faction with Liao the primary)

From the Liao side there seems to be two alternatives.

The first is to abandon the high ground and take the fight to the Swordsworn on the slope. If your opponent went artillery heavy, this may negate some of its usefulness. To make this viable because Liao will be 300 to 400, you would have to try to defeat your opponent in detail, not letting him mass his force against you. Additionally, the units you would want to use would be things with both a high attack value and defense value. The Liao targe would be a good choice because of the special rules. Essentially the attack will drop to 8 but everyone else is -2 (or -1 for infantry) to hit it making the armor rock solid, especially because of hardened. Arnis becomes attractive from this perspective too because his evade makes the normal armor vs shoot a 22 also. Danni Haag and Mason Dunne (if you have him) may also shine here. Their armor isn't as good but their attack remains a 10, even with the -2 and Haag has IT. Take infiltrate transports to get your infants in quick and provide the ability to allow your infantry to base opposing arty right off could make this nasty. The best defense is a good offense.

The second option is to engage from the lip of the plateau. You will need to take your own artillery and J-37. Your arty should be more accurate and anytime it is threatened you move it out of the way. The rest of your force should be relatively pushable (ie mechish) to be able to dodge ary and engage along the plateau line. Long range mechs with agility or high armor seem great for this.

I know this doesn't address specifics of your army but it might help you in thinking about strategy and streamlining your force.

Good afternoon. VTOLS should not because they are flying above the battle field. They have LOS to everything and vice versa. Of course if you got NOE then you will/should sure the same penalities. As for Arty, I don't think they suffer any penality for their blast pogs that is unless they go to direct fire mode against a target.

Those are logical thoughts, but unless the scenario rules are expanded, they won't apply. As it stands now, all vehicles, even artillery and VTOLs, will be -2 to move and attack.

Furthermore, with the pre-placed blocking terrain, there's only a small portion of the plateau top that artillery will have a clear line of fire to.

As a Swordsworn player actually thinking about playing, rather than sitting in the DZ for an hour, it's a challenge, not a slam dunk by any means.

i'm going to play the big cheese come this tourny, i have had enough playing good boy all the time, i'm going ss faction pure

3 X Balacs (ss)
1 X Balac (merc)
di towed AA (ss)
jl100 recovery (22)
merc sniper

etc, this is te bassis, and i will fill it in later

Those tricky units may not do so well. The SS Towed AA will be down to attack of only 5 for most of the field, so you'll be needing to roll 16s.

SS Balacs will have their move and fire range cut down to 20", which is inside even the least of the Partisan AA units. One or two perched on the edge of the plateau could cause major problems. They'll be at only 7 attack and need some good rolls to hit any of the better Liao targets, especially Targes.

I think I'll use either a Merc Crane VTOL or bring in a BR Lamprey to drop some good infantry on top of the plateau to keep the Liao forces busy until the man force can run up there. A pair of SS Locusts might be an interesting aproach here as well.

You need artillery for this scenario. Otherwise, your opponent will just shell you to death or beat you out on VC2.

Your army, Skyhorse, seems just about right for competative play. I would recomend substituting that merc crow for a Liao Fa Shih. That fa shih can hold on to units while your merc sniper blasts away. The minigun cycle could be used this way, but it replaces the ability to hold on to things for higher speed. Arty's power will be emphasized in this scenario for the Liao side, since everything else gets -2 movement, so it will be hard for them to get away, plus with that IT that Merc Sniper has, even if they move out of the way, you can try to hit them anyway. Your Balac and Targe are both going to have an advantage as well. The DF Donar would be better then the Balac, but you want to stay faction-pure and the Donar costs more too. However, I think that this is one of the better armies I have seen in a while. You get awe, the ability to counter "cheese", semi-faction-purity, and a strait-forward strategy. Just make sure to salvage or eliminate as much as possible.

Here is my pure Liao army:

:^^^: Targe(159)
2 :^^: DI Towed AA Arty(32x2=64)
6 :^^: Minigun cycle(12x6=72)

The arty is an obvious addition to the Liao forces due to the lowered movement the SS must indure.

I'm thinking i will shell with the DI's switching so they don't push. I was thinking of holding back the bikes and the targe at the line and let them come to me. I'm not sure what to do with the rest, please give feedback.

Build total is the basis for the gaining awe. You don't have to have exactly 300 points. Just have to have more than half your points per 300 point build total be elite to get awe. So in any 300 point army, a targe will give you awe.