In all the time I've been playing MWDA and posting on MWrealms I've heard a lot of people talking about cheese- for better or for worse, usually for the worse. So if you don't charge, if you don't tank drop, or use VTOLs or arty in gross abundance- What do you do? Another question to discuss here- is it cheesy to use camoflauge or any other high-defense units for strategy, is it cheesy to get a "touchdown" for VC3 as a primary army goal, or is it cheesy to use small expendable units as "meat shields" or grab base contact for base and blast strategies?

Is it all "cheese"- or is it all "spice"? I like to say "spice" myself- What do you think?

i don't think it's cheesy to go for the VC3 TD early...as a matter of fact, that's the core to my strategy...shhh :p

as for an army...well, here's a 500 point one that i don't think is cheese...it is faction pure...i haven't dusted it off in awhile either, and i really need to get around to making some new ones...

* Malisa Nova Cat
:^^^: Firestarter
:^: Merc Balac
:^^^: Crane
2 :^^: Shock Troops
:^^^: Crane
*Scorchers
*Shadow Stalkers
4 :^: HBs

some people might call it chese just because there's VTOLs in it...thoughts?

Marduk, trust me, the only way to maintain one's sanity is to just ignore the insanity.

You know what non-cheese players play? They play with dolls. Specifically, they think Mechwarrior miniatures should be used as dolls. Pass the lolly.

Personally, I think we're here to play a strategy game.

You know what's cheesey? Tasty poutine.

----edit: Zombie_bites, I hope you're joking about that army being, ahem, "cheesy". It's full of dismal pieces. Ooooh a VTOL - one that dies easily and has terrible range. How cheesy.

Obviously he was.

Zombie bites, I can see your on track- just need to update to 450/3 army building technique......

NightMoor, perfect reply...... I started my thread because I don't even understand why so many poeple spend so much time complaining about what? Winning? Losing?

I think people need to put less stress on units and strategy and remember that nothing is going to work if your dice are unlucky.

@NightMoor:
So you say that cheeseplayers play well when they use those same rutine tactics with those cheese units? In my point of view good player is one that can use well that he or she has without spending millions to this game. Ofcourse cheese units are usefull and good but i hope they would not be needed to win. Also becouse of this cjeese armies that use cheese units fun has desepeared from this game and its more like getting best minis and winning all prices than having fun. And do you have idea that you might have insulted people with that "doll comment" of yours?

Joppu: I think NightMoor was talking about MWDA dollies- not your Strawberry Shotcake dolls or Care Bears collections- Calm down dude!

@Marduk:
That NightMoor's comment just was too insulting becouse i'm non-cheese player my self and we play lot of variety of units in our armies.

Here is one of mine that is currently in Mobilisation Point:
Erin Johnston - Jupiter
DF Thumper Artillery
DF Bellona Tank
DF Gnome BA
DF Kanazuchi BA
2 DF Fanrir BA
TOTAL: 450pts. to the nose
There is only 1 artillery supporting others so its not cheese. Every piece in this army has its own purpose and its not based on some overpowerful units.

Joppu: Nice Army Dude- single arty with an assault mech to guard it is a good combo with the new rules.......I tend to go a little cheaper on the assault mech and use a little more "spice" as I call it.(maybe some VTOLs or transports)

You seem to understand where I'm coming from, sorry for the dolly jokes.

Hey, maybe the doll thing was out of hand, but aren't you doing the same thing, criticizing a group of players based on the units that they use?

- Wraith -

Kanazuchi, Scorchers are cheese!

I consider an army non-cheese when it is balanced and does not depend only on units or unit types that aren't very well thought out.

One artillery per 450 points is pefectly acceptable to me, even a Balac/Donar or two. Transport VTOLS aren't cheese at all as long as they are cap 2. Then fit in a nice Mech, some vehicles and infantry support, and you have a small nice army that no one can complain about if he looses against it.

I even play Arnis in such kind of an army. I know I know, most here call him cheese, but I don't play him cheesy. Most of the times, my Cats armies are as fast as hell, and Arnis serves well. I do not charge very often, even with Arnis. I use use his superior speed to get a rear arc shot and force the enemy to turn around in stead of shooting the rest of my army. Why should I charge and take damage for it? Arnis and Faisal have the main purpose to harass the enemy's artillery and deal with Mechs my basing at shooting. But maybe I'm just idealistic and the only one who thinks that a Mech should use its weapons instead of the body mass.

Hey guys, when it comes down to the crunch here, this whole game is 'cheese'! It's not some reality-like school of warfare, it's just a fun game to play. This whole 'this is cheese', 'that is cheese' is kinda spacey...

Oh, another cheese debate, how very original.

Well, what people always forget is to mention what 'cheese' is.
What people mean when they say 'Cheese' are units (or combinations of units) that are well ahead of the power curve of the game.

So tank dropping or charging in themself are not cheesy. Tank dropping becomes cheesy when you always drop a DF-Schmidt.

Basically non-cheese players play the same army types as the cheese players. However their armies might include other VTOLs than Donars or the S-Balac, they might drop different units than the DF-Schmidt, DF-Kanazuchi or S-TAC.