I've been on hiatus from Mechwarrior for a while. The game had just reached the point where my players lost interest for various reasons (some of which are rants on there own) and several personal things caused my interest to wane.

I started running the Solaris VII events again, and seem to have sparked interest after only 1 demo and 1 day of tournaments (2 players, but several former players were around and watched).

There are a number of things that are very attractive about S-Vii.

1) Quick play - A single Solaris VII match can be done in about 15 minutes. If I want to arrange it as such, I can have a full 3 round tournament (with 1 battle per round) finished in about 1 1/2 hours. There is a lot of of room to play around with different formats and find the "sweet spot" for a player group.

I've found that 3-4 hour tournaments have become a big turnoff for a lot of players. It's particularly bad for new players who want to play, but don't want to commit that many hours to a game they are just learning.

2) Delayed damage/heat - The reduction of the first strike advantage is a huge advantage with the dials. No longer do you have to worry about taking a hit because of poor timing and losing all ability to get your first attack off (OK, there is some worry, but much less).

The fact that damage (and heat) takes place simultaneously reduces the "I can't do anything" feel you can get in some battles. Again, this is pretty common in for new players, and they gain the most by this change (but, IMO, everyone gains here).

3) Maps - The maps are attractive and colorful. Most importantly, it reduces the "stretched" tape measure syndrome. Movement can be more easily measured in the game.

I suspect that I will be able to build my player group back up to a decent level. The games were fun, quick (even using the best of 3 per round format) and exciting.

I have not played Solaris at a local tournament yet, but I can add something that I really enjoyed from the GenCon Solaris Worlds experience: sheer fun factor!

When I arrive at a local tournament, there is usually a sense that some players have a chance at winning the tournament (those who are considered the "top" players), and everyone else is just there to have fun being beaten and compete for Fellowship. In Solaris, every opponent is a concern - because, basically, if they hit their first shot and you miss yours, you are in trouble. I don't care how much you might disrespect their Mech and pilot choice: every combatant is a threat, if they roll well and you roll poorly.

At GenCon, you had a sense that every player present (about 40 or so) had a legitimate chance of winning and getting their own pilot card. I imagine that local tournaments can capture some of this fun element as well: everyone there should feel like they have a chance to win. And Battlemasters should emphasize this.

Well, just to be a contrarian about this, I'll take the opposing view (although, to be honest, I happen to rather like Solaris quite a bit, and wish they'd adopt several of the Solaris mechanisms into the regular game).

As AshburyGrad points out, every player is a contender in Solaris because they can roll well while you might roll poorly. That's correct -- it's also the fundamental flaw with the Solaris sub-game: it's *WAY* too luck dependent.

Deciding what 'mech/pilot/gear combo to take, and using clever tactics during the game, are significantly less important in Solaris than they are in the standard game. There's little finesse to what you do on the field in Solaris, for the most part it's just close to contact and blast away (while watching your heat dial). If your unit takes a hit while your opponent doesn't, there's no pulling it back to let other elements of your army carry the fight -- your one 'mech is all on its own. When a game is that subject to extremes due to luck, why even bother with the figures -- why not just have both players roll the dice a couple times and the first to get a crit-hit wins (or conversely, a crit-miss loses)?

Now, admittedly, this paradigm changes when you're playing Solaris with multiple contenders in the same arena -- but when you're just playing one-on-one, the actual maneuvering for position is almost pointless, it's just about the die rolling. And if I wanted that, I'd go to Vegas and play craps.

Not true, Clown.

I've seen some Solaris VII battles which were decided by very clever maneuvering and herding of the foe. Admittedly, I beat the best Solaris player at the venue's recent Solaris VII tournament by sheer dice luck, but that player went on to win the tournament anyways on rep. Because he was very good at maximizing the advantages his pieces had over enemies. It CAN come down to raw luck, but it doesn't have to. And over a multi-round event (we had five rounds, to offset the bad influence byes had on a rep-based tournament), the best players do tend to drift to the top.

I'm waitiing for Saturday to try Soalris for the first time. I've been reading the rules,but still haven't has a chance to play yet.Also still trying to determine what to use for this weekends tourney.

Or two or more players with multiple units (especially on the larger battlefield).

I love playing Solaris VII for all the reasons that DBlizzard mentioned in the
opening post! Plus it really takes me back to my CBT days.

I'm even thinking of taking a sabbatical from conventional MW to focus strictly
on Solaris. ;)

I don't know if I would go this far.

To be fair, I agree with some of Clown's frustrations. And I failed to mention one thing I don't like about Solaris: less planning. For me, a big part of the fun of Mechwarrior is planning armies and changing builds, trying to come up with the perfect balance in a 600-point limit. In Solaris, there are basically three or four top builds per weight class, that are statistically better than all the others. It's a game of Rock-Paper-Scissors, and you just have to guess which one will work best for you.

To me, this is a dull metagame . . . but then, SAD still dominates after a year and a half, so you can argue that AoD has a dull metagame too. But there still seem to be more options than in Solaris.

But there's only been one full set, Wolf Strike, and some assorted packs to come out since the Seka/Aiko/Decoy combo became popular. Normally we'd have had at least 1, maybe 2, sets come out after Wolf Strike. That gives more of an opportunity for some mech, gear, pilot, PC, whatever combo to come out to make S/A/D less uber.

I'm sure there will be other stuff to steal the limelight away from SAD. I just hope these next ones would not be as popular. Copying armies is boring :-)

I like S7 a lot, its quick and vicious. Sure, its not as deep, but what can you expect from a 1vs1 game? There are only enough combinations and maneuvers that two units can do in pre-set maps. I'm happy with the system and hope that some elements make it to the regular game.

I love the fact that many mechs cannot run faster than their weapon's maximum ranges. That is very cool ang gives a shooty aspect to the game. OK, fine, light mechs are still super fast (solitaires w/ Sadat=fast) but the vast majority feel like fun platforms, THAT is a battlemech to me. :)

Close combat is also exiting, and the simultaneous resolution gives another depth to the thrill factor.

The only redeeming feature of S7 is the simultaneous damage nothing else. This game is way to simplistic and it plays slower than MW. It only seems to play faster because there is only one piece. The whole hex base movement and measuring system is a failure, and it is way to limiting.

At the venues I have been visiting most of the players also do not like how it plays. So my view is not a minority it is the majority. Also some of the venues I play at will not even play S7 they now play MW because the players do not like S7.

It seems to me one of the reasons why people have started to play a few games can be explained by WK giving away mechs as prize support not for the game.

Wat you don't like the simultaneous heat? GASP!
WHy do you say it's limiting? What does the hex based system limit? S7 only plays slower when you are first learning (and even then it's faster than a game of AoD). After that, it's very fast paced. It's a lot easier to count spaces and lines than it is to eek out that last sixteenth of an inch in AoD, or worry about placing your unit exactly where it was at after clicking the damage.

No, it's still minority...rather, it's ancedotal. It would be better to say that you are part of the local majority. TO claim your view is a majority for all MW players is an overstatement, because there is no way for you to know that.

While that may be true, some players enjoy the type of game S7 presents than others. I find S7 games to a great change of pace than AoD. I still love the strategic part of AoD, but I enjoy the quick decisions and gameplay of S7 as well. Others (such as those on this thread) may like it more or less. However, any game S7, AoD, CBT, or anything else caters to different types of gamers. Heck, even within AoD, there are playstyles and game types that cater to different groups. I think tha S7 is a great way to branch out and give the universe some more exposure.

Oh, is that why Classic Battletech is still as popular, worldwide, as it ever was
(if not more so)?

I don't think the tape measuring system is that bad. It is far from perfect, but thats hardly a reason to dislike the game.

Come on guys, lets show some enthusiasm for S7. The game is well-designed and it allows for a lot of quick fun.

I hope new maps would be available, I'm having mine scanned and then printed out on tarp so they last longer.




IMHO: What Solaris VII needs is a better manual with clearer examples and less confusing stuff. I also think the RD Camo - A gear may be on my battleforce sanctions list sometime soon to allow greater variety.