Here are a few from a discussion going on right now with a few people in the chat area. All of them were brought up by VS_Master. It seems to be his goal to make my brain hurt. If you haven't visted us in the chat room, you should. We are lonely and need your companionship. We like long walks in the....

Err, wrong chat board. Sorry about that.

Anyways, here goes. I think we figured most of them out but why not let you wrap your brain around them....

1- If my opponent activates Bitter Rivals and gives his Doctor Doom +3 for the attack on Mr. Fantastic and if this were to bring him to over double his attack printed on the card what would happen if I chained Foiled targeting my Bitter Rivals when my opponent tries to chain Overload on Doom?

2- My ooponent attacks with Scott Summers and in the defender compares attack to attacker's defense step, Crystal's effect is activated to pull him forward. Assuming the defender's attack was >= Summer's defense, will he be stunned?
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Amateur Movies

1. Targets are checked at declaration and resolution; if all targets are no longer valid at resolution, the effect does not resolve. In this situation, the effects would resolve Foiled, then Overload. Since overload requires not only a target character, but a target character with an attack value greater than twice his printed, the target is invalid and the effect does not resolve.

2. Any time after Cyke has exhausted and he is moved to the front row, his ability's requirements will no longer be met so the static ability will not be in effect.

I would like to metion that Bitter Rivals is not activated, it is a continues effect(Not sure if that is the correct Vs System term). It is just always on.

En-Kur,

Bitter Rivals provides Dr. Doom with an additional triggered ability, i.e. he gets +3 ATK whenever he attacks the named character.

That's very important to note because triggered powers generate an effect which starts or adds to a chain. Effects on the chain exist independent of their source.

At this point, playing Foiled and choosing Bitter Rivals as the target is of no use to you since Doom will still receive the +3 ATK bonus.

Your opponent's Overload will KO Doom if that bonus increases his ATK to more than twice Doom's printed ATK.

Next, there's your question on Cyclops, Scott Summers and Crystal.

If Cyclops is located in the support row when the attack begins, he cannot be stunned even if Crystal pulls him to the front row.

To get around this problem, use Crystal to bring Cyclops forward when the attack is announced but before it begins.

Good call on that Zaxx; I forgot to ttread Rivels as a Triggered ability not a static one. However, I'm not sure I agree with your ruling on Cyke -- his ability states "while attacking" from the support row; I believe this condition must be met at the time damage is dealt, since it is a replacement effect.

Let's ask. <see new thread>

This is funny. Duelist_Elrich asked me the exact 'Bitter Rivals' question last night on AIM. He was asking Ian Estrin this and many other perplexing questions. At like five this morning he said that they still had not come to a conclusion on this one.

He also had a good question about Genosha.

If you have five resources in your resource row and one of them is Genosha, do you get to keep the resource point it generates if you KO Genosha after your Recruit Step has begun?

After some discussion back and forth, I think we both agreed that you would get to keep the resource point. At the beginning of the Recruit Step, one resource point is generated for every resource you have in the resource row. If you played Genosha in your Build Phase and immediately flipped it and KO'd Genosha then you would only get four resource points for that Build Phase because the resource point for Genosha had not been generated yet. This is just another example of why it is going to be VERY important that players are clear as to when they are entering a new phase or step.

OK, now I just feel stupid. The guy I talked to last night was VS_Master. I just thought he had a universal realms account, but I was wrong. And yes, I agree that it seems as if his goal in life, at times, is just to make everyone's brain hurt, but, hey, we need someone to ask these questions.

Heh. I was in that chat last night with Mr. Stay At His Store Until Wee Hours In The Morning.

I know the answers and I can tell you that Zaxx is half-right... I just won't tell you which half.

The first half. And now that I know better, I won't be repeating my mistake on the second half.

So I like to hang out here sometimes and play Marvel and figure out the mysteries of life. :-P

Man Kristi was fussing when I got home. Gonna teach her to play tonight. Players with breasts have way more advantage than those who do not. Fear her.

Dave
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Extreme q

Yes, I think. The Bitter Rivals thing is a slam dunk. It generates an effect which is put on the chain. If the card is removed after the effect is generated, it doesn't matter.

Scott Summers generates a continuous effect. He was attacking from the support row, but now he is not. This ability isn't placed on a chain, so Crystal just bamboozled him, and he can be stunned.

I love seeing threads like this on questions that take so many people to think and answer them...that's how you know it's a good question. Anyway the whole Bitter Rivals thing is that Bitter Rivals is a triggered effect and will act independently from it's source once placed on the chain as was stated above and I am still getting confirmation on the Scott Summers thing but according to Ian:

The legality of a target is always checked on both announcement AND resolution. If there is no legal target you can't even announce the effect. And if ALL of an effect's targets have been made illegal, the effect is negated by the game rules. Negated means taken off the chain without resolving.

Note: If a triggered power has a conditional component (see Professor Xavier's Mansion) it will only trigger if its conditional component is satisfied. Then, when it resolves, it will check its conditional component again.

Now I believe since conditions are checked at announcement AND resolution...that Scott Summers would infact be stunned if this were to occur.

EDIT: And I keep on coming to these conclusions too late where you guys have already started another thread of 3 pages with this question hah...I will see if I can come up with some more crazy questions ooooooooo...I got one...hehe nice. See you all on another thread.

"2- My ooponent attacks with Scott Summers and in the defender compares attack to attacker's defense step, Crystal's effect is activated to pull him forward. Assuming the defender's attack was >= Summer's defense, will he be stunned?"

You can't add effects to the chain during Attack Outcome. If you were to use the Payment Power before the Attack Outcome and after Cyclops exhausts, then his Continous Powers condition is no longer met and he would be stunned.

What are we calling "Attack Outcome"?

Step 4 in the attack outline. where you determine the which of the potential outcomes of an attack to use and characters compare ATK and DEF. Also has been reffered to as attack resolution before.