What's the worst ruling calls you had in a Vs tournament (not casual but in Hobby League, Prerelease or PCQ)? The ruling is obviously wrong, gave your opponent the advantage and probably cost you the game.

For me, it was during the X-Men prelease, my opponent claimed that if his character was stunned with Mindtap Mechanism, he would still get counters. One of the judges agreed with him "becauase that's how fantastic car works".

PCQ. The judge rules that stunned characters don't have a cost, meaning my Mr Hyde can't swing for the win (didn't have +2/+2 stat increase). Winning that game would have put me in top 4 and a prize split. (game cut to top 4, only 9 players, and it was 11pm so we were doing a split)

At a local PCQ back when the origins were the only sets out, a judge ruled that Global Domination could not negate Genosha. That cost someone a bubble game.

If you've ever been to Kings Games, you'd know all about em. Its been ruled you cannot use Terra targeting a stunned character, and it has also been ruled that you cannot Betrayal in response to a Midnight Sons (The guy had 3 Betrayals too, cost him a chance at Top 8)

I lost the first round of the first PC to what I now call the "Cheatyface" rule.

And that is what, exactly? This ought to be a gooder... lol

The "Cheatyface" Rule refers to the MTG Unhinged card Cheatyface, which, if your opponent sneaks it into play without you noticing, gets to stay. (note that I am in no way accusing anyone of cheating)

My first experience with the rule was at the 1st PC Indy, playing against a player for whom I have the utmost respect. He's using BBH, and I'm GK curve.

In combat, he powers up, and I HaB his Lost City. A flurry of power-ups later, we resolve combat, and move on to the next turn.

When we swiftly realize that Lost City is still there.

A judge is called. The possible rulings are:
a) Game loss for my opponent (by the tournament rules at the time, the correct ruling);
b) game losses for both of us (more fair than option a, since it was my mistake as well);
c) get rid of the Lost City now (kinda lame, since he's drawn cards since, but still acceptable); and
d) The Lost City stays somehow (lolz who woud do this?)

Naturally, the City stays, and the Cheatyface Rule is born. I lose the game (which I assure you I would have won had I not somehow missed on a HaB), and get a horrible draw game three to lose the match.


Next PC (SoCal 04), a friend of mine realizes during a match that his opponent had recovered an extra character the previous turn. The head judge is called, but naturally, The Cheatyface Rule wins the day, and the character stays.

Yeah, rules enforcement used to really suck in this game.

One of our judges said that defenders can cause breakthrough to an attacker.

It's situations like these that make me wish the Lvl 1 judge test was more difficult. Anyone with even just a basic understanding of the game can become a judge. Because of this, a lot of certified judges that have power to overrule you, don't know #### about the game, at least no more than the average player.

And maybe they should retest you when each set comes out to make sure you know the latest rules. Then again, I don't think the judges test has changed since Marvel/DC origins (since those are the only sets the questions come from if memory serves) anyways so this isn't very likely

If the Level 1 judge test was more difficult, no one would be a judge, and stores wouldn't have ANY.

Stores need to be more selective in who is judging, and go with proven guys, and admit when mistakes are made so everyone learns.

Second Round of MXM SP. The judge ruled that If Xorn is recovered normally during wrap up, Xorn could use his effect to recover someone else. The HJ cleared that up quickly.

Trust me, I know how 'fun' that type of situation can be. One of the worst feelings in the world is when you're playing, knowing precisely why something does or doesn't work, having to debate with or even teach a head judge about a rule. If my penchant for having pretty ####ty luck continues, I'll probably end up doing more judging just so other people don't have to get themselves in that kind of situation.

i'm glad that there aren't any of my players posting in here....lets just keep it that way so that no one has to get the Indian Burn...or the wretched smurf bite!

Like any game judges will progress with experience. As much as I know we'd all love to say it but it's not true that you can immediately jump into the game and start judging and know absolutely everything about the game. Sure you won't have a good enough grasp on the game first, but when you yourself think you do, then you'll always find that there is something else you didn't take the time to look at before and you'll make a mistake. It happens.

I've been judging that other UDE card game for the better part of 3 years now. I still make the occasional mistake (mostly minor stuff that I catch immediately) but I'll say that there have been cases in the past that I've definitely made a big boo boo. As a judge you have to realize you made the mistake later and take it in stride and make sure it doesn't happen again. This is how a judge really progresses through the game, mistakes are gonna happen, you can't really stop them unless you just pretty much write the rules for the game.

I've been playing/judging VS now for the better part of 2 years and I'll have to say that I've made a few VS mistakes as well in my early judging stint. Sure, there were maybe other circumstances (like no sleep the night before) but I've definitely buckled down and studied the game, which might not have happened it it weren't for the fact that every event I play/judge at I have our own cdaniel (Chad Daniel) present who is there to help me along with the game rules.

Because of that I'm a level 2 VS judge and look forward to judging events rather than maybe dreading them wondering if there is anything I missed or might get confused by. At least with VS this game is pretty straight forward, things don't just all of a sudden change or in other cases there aren't exceptions to any given rule except that if there is one the card will explicitly say there is.

With all that said I'm not sure if I'm a big fan of threads like this. Bickering over someone's mistake from way back when is not really gonna do much. Sure it's a point of conversation and something that everyone can definitely indulge us with story-wise, but one wrong slip/word and this thread could just turn upside down completely.

Let's keep it civil guys and remember that judges are humans too, and they'll make mistakes from time to time. Just some make fewer mistakes than others.

But I don't think the point of this thread is to bash judges as a whole. I think there should be a line drawn between judges who occasionally make somewhat reasonable bad calls and judges who somehow passed the Judge exam and ruled that defenders cause breakthrough. This is what I can't stand. I have no problems with judges making mistakes, I make a few myself (maybe more than a few) but they're not because I don't know the basic fundamentals of the game. Seems like you should know that before you're aloud to become a judge.

So what's worse, not having a judge at all, or having a judge who doesn't know the basics of the game and frequently rules incorrectly (thereby causing other players to not learn the game correctly because they're trusting a judge who doesn't know anything)?