Is Ally a payment power??

Whenever you power up, and your ally goes off, can it be negated by things that stop payment powers

no, its a triggered effect

a payment power is an effect with the "arrow", "-->", or ">>>" (that just depends on where exactly you look it up)

the only Keyword ability that is a payment power is Evasion, which reads "Stun this character --> at the start of the recovery phase this turn, recover this character" i have acctually negated that a couple of times

Thanks, I was wondering if there was any text that ally had, but your right it is triggered.

Just so you know, Power Up's on the other hand ARE a payment power. So negating the power up in the first place negates a BUNCH of ally effects. Hehe.

-Mike

RanmaSolo: That is not correct. Power-Up's are *not* payment powers. They are game-based effects. Anything that specifically negates a payment power *cannot* be used to negate a power-up.

RanmaSolo loses the thread.

:)

Unfortunately. I hate those JLA Ally decks...

Are you sure? I thought it was worded as a payment power and I remember discussion of Abra Kadabra stopping power ups with his effect.

Hmmm, in the comp rules it refers to the effect of a power up being "continuous" lasting for "this attack" but I think it IS a payment power.

"708.5c Any player may play a game-based effect that reads, “Target attacker or defender you control becomes powered-up,” the cost of which is discarding a character card that shares a name with the target character. Since power-ups have “this attack” as their duration, players may play this game-based effect only during an attack substep. (See rule 507.1b.)"

Still it never specifically says what type of power it is. Payment, triggered or continuous. If you can, would you please cite in the rules where it explicetly states such information?

-Mike

Yes, I am sure.Abra Kadabra, Citizen Abra does not prevent a player from powering-up.

From the DJL FAQ:

Power ups are not payment powers, the discard is simply the cost/payment of a game based effect.

SlowMail is correct.

Power-Ups are game-based effects that have a cost. That cost is to discard a character card with the same name as an attacker or defender you control. The fact that you have to pay for it, does not make it a payment power.

Be careful about generalizing costs to mean payment. Recruit effects, equip effects, locations, and plot twists all have costs also, but you wouldn't call those payment powers.

Payment powers are very clear in this game. EVERY payment power has a "-->". Even Evasion, because that keyword directly translates to "Stun this character-->At the beginning of the recovery phase, recover this character." If you don't see the arrow, it's not a payment power.

The exemple with abra kadabra is when you play against bastion. Thus Abra does not prevent power ups, but he prevents bastion from using his "power-up" like effect, since it is a payment power.

It's very easy to remember : payment powers are the ones with the arrow ->, no more no less (activated powers are payment powers !!)

I know payment powers have an arrow, that's very basic. I wasn't generalizing either, the confusion is that the rules never write out the power up "power" in full under the actual section on powering-up. They have a partial text of the rule and as a "game based effect" it DOES say that.

However, I was confused by the fact it mentions continous, triggered and payment as the only type of powers with nothing about game based effects. Therefore without having read the Game Based Effects section in a long time I was under the impression that each game based effect was one of the three types of powers.

In any case it's made obvious by the JLA FAQ that power-up isn't a payment power, thank you Slow Mail for citing something in the rules that made it clear.

Next time I guess I'll just check the comprehensive rules a little more completely myself to find the relevent text before I ask somebody else to point it out. Hehe. :p

-Mike

Ah, I think I might see something that was confusing the issue for you---powers vs. effects. Continuous, triggered, and payment actually are the only types of powers. Powers exist on cards, and any power can fit into one of those three categories; of the three, triggered and payment powers can also generate effects. But powers aren't the only ways to generate them---here's something of a random quote from the CRD:So, some powers generate effects, and some effects come from powers, but there's definitely leeway, too.

It's one of those distinctions which is basic, but which is also really easy to overlook since you don't really need to talk about it during a game. :)

Boost is a payment, right?