I don't think Heroclix was ever specifically a kids game. Didn't Wizkids take a survey awhile back and determine that the primary demographic for heroclix was males aged 18-35? People older and younger play, to be sure, but the average buyer of product was in that range.

Oh, and I like special powers, so I don't consider backtracking on that to be a good thing. I also happen to think that the whole strategy thing is fun. You don't have to pick one or the other.

Love the idea and the use of the word "masturbatory".

I do not believe that heroclix was originally a kids game. You also have to understand how old a kid has to be in order to like strategy games. From what I have noticed both being in the classroom and playing heroclix at a venue, kids need to be in the 5th or 6th grade to try heroclix. This is the basic grade level where strategies and tactics are a higher level of thinking that the kids will be able to handle. At these grades the kids are usually learning chess and working at getting better at checkers. This is also the grade that most kids are getting into stuff like Magic: The Gathering.

I do not agree with reverting to an alpha-like game, despite the fact that I love playing alpha. What the company has to do is market to those middle school aged kids by having a better price than a CCG and interesting characters.

Definitely against. We were finally getting to the point where I felt characters were getting accurate representations through the use of the SP's and Traits. Taking that away would be a big mistake.

No. I am against "dumbing" down the game, and to do so in the name of kids is counter to the fact that kids learn a lot quicker to us old farts.
Ever tried teaching this game to someone in their 30's? heh....
I've said this a few times now and I stand by it. There is nothing wrong with the game as it stands.
There's also nothing wrong with heroclix alpha...wasn't for me (not deep enough) but it's a great option for this thread and for filling out teams with favorite characters or keywords at lower cost.

Even though they take opposite views of special powers, I agree with some of both tidge and batjester's comments.
I like special powers and think they have really made people think about the nuances of the characters they play. But for most of these, if it represents the character's abilities it really should be across their entire dials, so more traits might be a better, less complicated solution. I may like them, but I think special powers have gotten just a bit out of control, and should be reduced, but I would hate to see them eliminated.

I think keywords have become a big pain in the rear. I have 2100 different Heroclix figures, and have them organized so I can pick theme teams, but no way can I remember them. For unrestricted (which more people seem to want at least a couple of times a month) you basically have to just take every opponent's word that they have the keyword. Even the most honest people make mistakes, and going to a list to check every character's keyword is just not workable.

I still like feats. They allow a little flexibility and creativity in team building, are available to lots of characters, you have to "pay" to use them, and they don't overly complicate game play.

I am sort of neutral on special objects.

I don't like BFCs that much. Anything that can COMPLETELY negate a well thought out strategy just rubs me the wrong way. A well constructed team that is played well and destroys my strategy is to be admired, but basically throwing down a card that does it seems lucky, cheap, something. I know lots of people like them, but to me the downside just seems to outway the good.

As to the OP, I agree that a couple of things have gotten a bit too complicated, but would hate to have the game simplified too much. Just wouldn't be nearly as interesting or fun for very long.

IMO, the rules should be simplified to some extent.

The way it is at the moment, in order to become a better player of HC, you have to study rules, erratas, etc, to find the best synergies (or loopholes, whichever way you wanna look at it), instead of improving your skills in tactics or strategy.

After all, chess has very simple rules, but layers on layers of complex strategy. Complex rules are not needed for strategically challenging game play.

Complexity is just complexity, it's neither good nor bad in and off itself.

I'd be flat out done with the game if it came to this.
No special powers and all that makes boring stagnant dials.
What's the point of getting new stuff when the last 10 wolverine's looked close to identical with powers.. Thanks but no thanks..

In the case of Wolverine:

We haven't yet had a "Wild Card" or Avengers Wolverine.

We don't have an Indomitable Wolverine (which would certainly help those prone to having Regeneration), and would mitigate the need to have insanely high defense values/damage reducers.

Like many close-combat pieces, Wolverine needs to be a threat with some move+attack, and "invuln" cracking...and we've seen dials like the Sinister Wolverine, but also Karate Kid/Timber Wolf that are dangerous at a variety of point prices with no 'special white powers'.

Naturally because of the existence of Automatic Regeneration it is easy to imagine a Wolverine with that as a special white power, but I certainly wouldn't mind having a move+attack/Indomitable 'classic' Wolverine at a more build-friendly 60-points.

I am too huge of a fan of Special Powers to want to go back. And since most of the non Special Power sets are retired, it only makes since to keep going forward.

Going backward to the way it was will never work. Going to Alpha rule will make me want to hide in my room with my "cool" clix. Never to make another tournament appearance.

So a big no to simplifying everything. It works now just fine.

Agreed.
I'd love an indomitable wolvie or an auto regen one. Heck I still want to see the one with a click of impervious up front (fast healing) and regen for the rest of his 8-9 click dial. Yes give him the ability to get back to click 1.

But the fact of the matter is, an overly simplistic version of the game would just kill interest in it.

IMO.

Simple is great to help people learn, complex is better to get people to play and enjoy the game. Once again purely IMO

He!! NO!

filler

Agreed.

- Ahrimanos

Absolutely, 100% against. If I wanted such a game, I'd play Attacktix.

I agree the game needs to be simplified...but not dumbed down.....make things more streamlined.

Ive seen that statement in various forms over and over again. The game designers would be amis if they haven't caught onto that many cries to that purpose.

Heck even their attempts at Batman Alpha shows they know the rules are too cumbersome and quirky for newer players to readily grasp them.....otherwise they would never have made a Batman Alpha,....duh.

wes