Just out of curiosity, when does his power happen? I know it was discussed in a thread and brought up actually on the wizkids site, but could you use his power to give him and adjacent friendlies poison, then deal the poison damage?
Like how Outwit works with poison?
It does say "once per game", but doesn't mention when during your turn.

Absolutely. It's a free action, and free actions can be granted before other "at the beginning of your turn" effects occur.

So Mikron could give himself and two friendly characters Poison; one of those friendly characters could then Outwit an adjacent enemy's damage reducing power; and then you could use that Poison.

You could even mix it up a bit more. Let's say that you've got Mikron plus two friendly characters basing a rookie Shazam! on his first click, and there's a friendly Superman Enemy on the map:

1. Use Unbelievable Weaponry to allow the use of Poison
2. First friendly character uses Poison against rookie Shazam! (on his first click).
3. Shazam! now has Impervious. Mikron copies Superman Enemy. Outwit the Impervious.
4. Second friendly character uses Poison.
5. Shazam! now has Invulnerability. Another of the friendly characters uses Superman Enemy and Outwits the Invulnerability.
6. Third friendly character uses Poison.

This is not true. Nothing about being a free action ever implies that something can be used at the beginning of the turn.

For example, Nanobots is a free action which can't be used then.

This would be true if the power could be used at the beginning of the turn. It says it can be used once per game, but there is no text to suggest that it can be used during the beginning of the turn.

If it said once during the game, it would be different.

Unbelievable Weaponry Once per game (but not during another action) when Mikron O'Jeneus is adjacent to a non-held object, as a free action remove that object from the game and choose a standard attack power. Mikron O'Jeneus and up to two friendly characters adjacent to Mikron O'Jeneus can use that power until the beginning of your next turn (even if they are no longer adjacent to Mikron O'Jeneus).

The only restriction appears to be that you cannot use the power during another action.

I'd happily accept that you cannot use Unbelievable Weaponry during an opponent's turn (as the FF rulebook indicates that free actions occur during your turn) but you'll have to explain in greater detail why this free action cannot be used at the beginning of your turn when other free actions (that do not specify the beginning of the turn) can be used in such a way.

Basically, because the highlighted part is not true.

If it doesn't specify that it can be used at that point, then it can't be used at that point.

Nanobots is a free action which doesn't specify that it can be used during the beginning of the turn, so it cannot be used during the beginning of your turn.

Outwit, Perplex, and Leadership are examples of free actions which do specify that they can be used at that point, so they can.


The highlight above allows it to be used at any time, which includes the beginning of your turn.

The "once per game" in Gizmo's power is limiting how often it can be used, but doesn't affect when it can be used. As I said before, if it said "once DURING the game" then it adds the timing to the mix.

EDIT: Here's another good example:
Sincorps Batman: "Dark Knight: Batman can use Flurry and Smoke Cloud. If Batman has no action tokens when he uses Smoke Cloud, he can use it as a free action once this turn."
This power specifies that it is a free action which can only be used once per turn, but cannot be used at the beginning of the turn because it doesn't specify that it can.

One minor correction - Leadership specifically says "once at the beginning of your turn". You could not use it during your turn, only the beginning.

Harpua, the rulebook states about ALL actions: "Giving actions to characters. During your turn, you give actions from your action total to your characters."

... how does your explanation make exception for Outwit/Perplex again?

Perhaps I missed it (and not to be obnoxious here), but what text prevents REGULAR actions from taking place at the beginning of one's turn?

Note that saying "once per game" does not give a carte blanche to give actions on an opponent's turn - ergo, the only times one can assign actions at all (barring exceptional things like Pluto's SP) are during one's turn.

I'm going off of what the ruling is.

Basically the ruling is the way that it is to prevent you from giving all of your actions at the beginning of the turn.

Personally, I'd have no problem if the phrasing used in Outwit and Perplex was reruled so that they can't be used at the beginning of the turn. I think it would be more consistent and intuitive. There's a reason why we get a "My opponent OWed my guy before he Poisoned me, is this legal?" thread about once a month.

That said, the ruling is what it is.

Based on the language used alone, I'm afraid I can't see a reason to allow one and not allow the other aside from "it is what it is".

"During your turn" doesn't seem to imply anything special (unlike, say "any time during your turn") that would allow beginning-of-turn free actions if free actions are not generally permitted to occur at the beginning-of-turn.

Even worse, the F4 rulebook (p7, section "Giving actions to characters") begin with : "During your turn, you give actions from your total to your characters". If the "During your turn" mention is enough to give the action at the begining of ti, then you should be allowed to give non-free actions to characters before the begining of the turn.
I'm kinda puzzled, because I never really though about it : I use Outwit before Poison because I knew it was legal, never bothering thinking of the "why". Now I got to stand with Harpua when he says it shouldn't be : no actions, free or not, should be given at the "begining of your turn" phase (it's pretty logical that "begining" happens before anything else), except if specifically stated.
Another solution to make this as clear as possible would be to add a line sayin' "even at the beginning of your turn" on powers like Outwit.
But until then, the rules are the rules...

Heroclix became a complicated game sometimes. :cross-eye

When I'm in doubt I use comic acurate feeling, common sense or a dice. :cross-eye

It may not seem to imply anything, but we've been told for years that when added to a power, it sufficiently covers the ability to use that power at any time during the turn, including the beginning of the turn. Basically, by default all actions are going to be given during your turn, so that phrase in Outwit would be superfluous if it wasn't there for some other reason.


This doesn't even really contradict the use of the phrase in the rulebook. The phrase in the rulebook says that you can give actions during your turn, but that doesn't necessarily mean that all actions can be given at all times.


In regular language, you say that there's nothing special abuot the "during your turn" phrase. As with most things in the game, it has its own meaning within the game. That meaning, when used in a power, has been defined to mean "at any time during your turn."


I'll just add that Norm already chimed in on this.

Sorry Harp, I´m really not following you nor Normalview on this one (no point in quoting him too)

I agree that the power says that the adjacent figures CAN USE the power...
But also a lot of special powers that are accepted as prerequisite of feats also say things like "Juan Charlanga can use this really really really powerfull yellow thingie in his attack slot".

I understand what you say about using the power on his own too as the rules book states.

But the part I don´t understand is the one in wich you say "while he can use the power on his own, he can´t use it on his own on that click".
This is the part I don´t understand.

Once the fliying bald cucumber uses his special power the fig can use the power on his own. At least until the beggining of next turn.

So I went to the rules book to clarify myself a little more, this is the first fig I remember that can "give" powers to friendly figs.

I found this:

Using feats. In order for a character to use a feat assigned to it, all prerequisites for the feat must be printed on the character’s base and/or visible on its combat dial through the stat slot.

I think this is the real answer to the question.
It is not a matter of being able to use the power, it only depends if it is visible in the printed base or combat dial.
The power the fig can use now because FBC used his special power is not printed on the dial or visible in the combat dial slot.

Sorry to rewrite this, but I think it would be more clear for inexperienced players. :D

Doesn't matter... if they are getting the power from UNBELIEVABLE WEAPONRY, they do not possess the power (on that click at least). Like you said, but in slight different form.

FF rules, page 19:

Using feats. In order for a character to use a feat assigned to it, all prerequisites for the feat must be printed on the character’s base and/
or visible on its combat dial through the stat slot. If using a feat requires giving the character an action, then the prerequisites must be present on the combat dial at the time the player gives the character the action.

A special power might not let a character possess a certain power, put that SP (and all its associated powers) is on the dial; powers gained through UNBELIEVABLE WEAPONRY are not.

Which is all, basically, what we said before

Thank god I'm not a rules deputy. I think I'd shatter at least one monitor a week.

Thanks for all the answers!