Disagreeing (respectfully or otherwise) doesn't make us any less right.

It's boiling down to this question (that I've repeated a few times already): Who is the person targeting?

The 'counting squares' is to cover characters like AvX Prof X, or the SPO that you said was on your team. His special power that works "within 8 squares" can also be counted from Tellus et al since it doesn't target.

(forgot that SPO's power didn't 'target')

I see the logic, I'm still stuck at me being able to count squares for my distance from you from another, closer point.

No need to be snarky, if you are bored of the discussion feel free to refrain from replying, this is a rules discussion forum and as such, if I have a question or disagree with a posted opinion/ruling, I will do so for as long as I am interested in the topic and/or until my curiosity is satiated.

As written, theharpiece is correct here. Tellus' power specifically says that friendly characters can count squares from the square of any one friendly character within 4 squares of Tellus.

How can you tell who is within 6 squares of Darkseid? You count out 6 squares from him. But Tellus lets you start counting those squares from any friendly character within 4 squares of Tellus.

Incidentally, this also breaks Tellus. How can you tell who is within 4 squares of Tellus? You count out 4 squares from Tellus. But Tellus can also start counting squares from any friendly figure within 4 squares of him. So now figures that are 8 squares away can be considered 4 squares away from him.

edit: This is obviously not how it's supposed to work, but the way it's currently written makes it work this way.

Sorry about the snark, that was unintentional.

Actually, after rethinking it, I might be wrong. The counting squares thing is interesting.

All I know is, one way or the other, Tellus needs to be on the watch list.

Counting squares is interesting, sure. But I still think without the power saying "as if he occupied that square," I think the map still trumps it. With the watch list and all, this whole discussion may become irrelevant, but I understand that until then you want to make sure you've got it squared away (so to speak).

That said, our venue has been ruling it that way since the set released. He's only been played on Legion teams, so we haven't had any of the SPO's or Prof X type issues come up yet. Like others said, since there is no targeting with those SP's, they can still use the full extension of range afforded by Tellus.

Can we get an orange ruling here?

What do you want an orange ruling on? The original question has been answered by Harpua, though he may not be an orange anymore, I'm sure he is correct.

Seems to me that countign squares for the map itself is covered by Tellus's power. Subscribing to see answer. That said, this might all change with the 2014 watchlist.

No matter what happens to Tellus in the future, this ruling will stand. Even if you can count squares and range, it doesn't change the fact that you are more than 6 squares away. When it comes to SPO or Prof X, yes the opposing characters are within 8 squares of you, but you are also more than 6 squares away from them.

Let me see if I can expand this ruling a bit by explaining how they interact.

Tellus allows us to count squares and draw line of fire from not only our own square but from any square of a friendly figure within 4 squares of Tellus. All spots are taken into account when determining the effects of powers. For example if you Pulse Wave within 4 squares of Tellus you draw your lines of fire and create an area of effect not only from your own square but also from your available square from Tellus.

http://www.hcrealms.com/forum/showpo...4&postcount=11


The same interaction happens with the Shadowlands map. The game effect asks if the number of squares between you and your target is greater than 6. If you are 8 squares from your target, Tellus is 6 squares and another friendly character is 3 squares you count from all of those to determine if you are more than 6 squares away. Counting the squares returns 3 values 8,6,and 3. Shadowlands does not come into effect on the 6 or 3 square results, but you also counted 8 squares and Shadowlands comes into effect blocking you from targeting that character.

This would be significantly different if Shadowlands was instead worded:
In this case Shadowlands would be applying a blanket ban on targeting that is lifted by being able to count a number of squares of 6 or less.

What? No....If I am using Johnny Blaze through Tellus....

HELFIRE SHOTGUN: When Johnny Blaze makes a ranged combat attack against a single character, you may replace his damage value with 4 minus the number of squares to the target and lock it. If the target has two action tokens, the damage from the attack is penetrating damage.

I dont take three different values, I pick one...You would pick one value, this is not Algebra, we are not graphing a line...We are counting squares....

The only question is, does being physically farther than 8 squares away on the map stop you from targeting even though you can begin counting your distance from another figure from a different spot. Although Harpua did answer, or rather, affirmed a theory, it would be nice to have an orange ruling with an explanation.

The answer is yes, being more than the determined squares away does stop you. On the Shadowland map or any rule that says you can't do something if you are x squares away, then you can't do it if you are x squares away.
The explanation is quite simple. You are both less than and greater than 6 squares away. You're less than through Tellus, but you are still physically greater than because your character is more than 6 squares away.

(Shadowland is 6 not 8)

We had a similar discussion about large base characters and being 5 or more squares away from a starting area. You can be 5 squares away and still be within 4 squares if your base is large enough, therefor you would not be eligible for hammers from the Book.