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Roy claims that Adam targeted Darkstone, and Adam corroborated this.
However, I RTed Roy, and DB targeted him. We know DB is a MDer, so therefore, Roy would have been MDed to someone other than Adam and could not have seen Adam target DS, which Adam would therefore not be able to corroborate. That is the implication.
Of course a simple explanation is that DB was RBed last night. Not unlikely given the amount of heat they had. And I am tending to trust Roy.
Sloonei, have you seen that scene in Pulp Fiction, where Samuel L. Jackson says, "My name's Pitt, and your ass ain't talking your way out of this #$@^?" I mention it because the more you try to question why I and others are suspicious of you, and the more you ask for people to justify reads on you, the more scummy you appear to me. Townies don't play with fear. You say who you are and what you do and if someone doesn't like it, tough cookie. I understand you play in a site where everyone is constantly asked to justify everything in an attempt to "outjoust" everyone else, but frankly, we ain't buying whatever it is you're selling.
You're describing that you are a dragger, is that right? What is your power called (paraphrase it for me, PLEASE don't quote word for word)? Also, I don't buy that a veteran like you and as active as you've been would have missed an action, to be honest. My vote stays.
I am not playing with fear. I play by asking a lot of questions to try and understand the thought processes of the other players in the game. So when a player calls me suspicious for absolutely no reason, I ask for a reason. You've still not given one, other that I've asked why I'm suspicious. On the one hand I find that to be bogus, and on the other it does nothing to explain the initial suspicion.
I missed the action. I was working constantly for a few days there so it just slipped my mind. Oops. Why are you so insistent on getting role information out of me?
Roy claims tracker (super common town role, semi rare mafia role)
N1: Targets DB. Gets results saying DB targeted Iggy
N2: Targets Adam. Gets results saying Adam targeted Darkstone.
SL claims reverse tracker (pretty dang common town role, rare mafia role)
N1: Targets Iggy and learns the following players targeted Iggy: Silver, Grinner
DB claims misdirector
N1: Targets Grinner, as per usual
Grinner claimed vigilante (lie)
N1: Claims he was misdirected (potential lie)
Adam implies...what he implies
N2: Claims to have targeted Darkstone.
So Roy is the odd man out on N1. Could be lying or was misdirected.
On N2, Adam confirms Roy's results. Could be confirming Roy was misdirected or they could be buddies.
If Roy was telling the truth and was misdirected, this doesn't make him town for sure.
Similarly, Silver could actually be a scum power cop pretending to be a reverse tracker. Scum tend to fake tracker/reverse tracker claims, throwing out unverifiable or already revealed results, results that a teammate vouches for, often pointing to how they caught the sk/a cult player to "prove" they are truly a town info gatherer.
With all this background and analysis on the table, I still trust Silver in the 80-90% range. It's really against his meta to fake being an info gatherer this early or draw attention as a scum info gatherer. Roy is generally more ballsy but DB gets himself lynched a pretty high portion of the time (sorry DB) and wouldn't be worth framing with a false info gathering claim that would then have to be answered for upon his flip. I'd rank the odds of Roy's truthfulness at a 65-70%.
Thank you for this rundown. I felt Silver was more believable in the original exchange as well, so if one of them is lying I would guess that it is Roy, which also seems to potentially implicate Adam, I think. BUT a lot of this Night Action analysis is foreign to me and just has my head spinning, so I can't pretend to have a firm grasp on it, but I'm trying.
I am not playing with fear. I play by asking a lot of questions to try and understand the thought processes of the other players in the game. So when a player calls me suspicious for absolutely no reason, I ask for a reason. You've still not given one, other that I've asked why I'm suspicious. On the one hand I find that to be bogus, and on the other it does nothing to explain the initial suspicion.
I missed the action. I was working constantly for a few days there so it just slipped my mind. Oops. Why are you so insistent on getting role information out of me?
Okay Sloonei, some slack cause you're new even though you're not.
Adam tried to explain it pretty artfully below, but the more you ask for assistance, information, and people's reasoning all data which could help you "weasel your way out" of whatever someone may have on you, is a big red flag for most of us. I get that is how you play. I am telling you it makes you look scummy for most of us. You answer allegations and then people say what they have on you, which of course may be nothing more than a hunch. That's how it works man.
Quote : Originally Posted by mbauers
Ok, so this game's finally over?
Who the eff daykilled me back to back days? Seriously.
I do think that it's a cultural thing, to an extent. The Realms meta involves wanting those who are targeted with pressure votes to offer up some information about themselves before the pressurer (is that a word?) says Why they are suspicious.
This is because power roles are very strong in our games and so pressure is often motivated by information obtained at night. Therefore, if I tracked you targeting a dead player, I don't want to tell you that's why I am voting for you, because it gives you more information to back up your story.
Example: say you're mafia and you have just killed jackofhearts the previous night. The next day, Immortal Raven drops a vote on you early. You know you're mafia and committed the kill. You don't know if IR copped you as mafia, or if he tracked you as making a kill, so you don't know what to make your cover story. If you knew that you were copped as mafia, you might try claiming to be a miller (a townie who cops as mafia). If you knew you were tracked targeting jackofhearts, you could claim you were a misdirector or role blocker or info gatherer, who just coincidentally happened to target the dead guy. But by not knowing the info IR has on you, you don't know what you should lie about.
That's not to say it's better or worse, just different, and is motivated by the fact our games have lots of strong power roles and info gatherers.
I hope that explanation helped?
This is the most helpful explanation yet of the heat I received, thank you. It actually makes some sense in this context.
Like I've said a few times, where I come from role claims are illegal so every suspicion should be substantiated by content in the thread. If someone just comes in and vaguely states "I find Sloonei suspicious" then everyone in the game, not just me, will look at that person and say "Okay... why?" There's no other way for us to play. So when I saw it happening here, I did what I know to do best. I know that no one can have any info on me that paints me in a bad light because I targeted a living player in Night 1 who, as far as I know, has reported no ill-effects, and then I failed to do anything on Night 2.
Huh, considering that if we lynch Roy and he's scum, you're suspect #1, this is way to helpful.
I'm, just trying to figure out if association means causation here.
I think Silver's analysis is the most likely option; the mafia have a tracker, and Roy used that information even though he didn't personally obtain it. I definitely targeted Darkstone, which Darkstone confirmed.
Okay Sloonei, some slack cause you're new even though you're not.
Adam tried to explain it pretty artfully below, but the more you ask for assistance, information, and people's reasoning all data which could help you "weasel your way out" of whatever someone may have on you, is a big red flag for most of us. I get that is how you play. I am telling you it makes you look scummy for most of us. You answer allegations and then people say what they have on you, which of course may be nothing more than a hunch. That's how it works man.
I am asking questions because I want to understand what is happening so that my judgment here in this game can be as clear as possible. I am making no effort to be a weasel. I ask a lot of questions even when I do know what is going on.
This is the most helpful explanation yet of the heat I received, thank you. It actually makes some sense in this context.
Like I've said a few times, where I come from role claims are illegal so every suspicion should be substantiated by content in the thread. If someone just comes in and vaguely states "I find Sloonei suspicious" then everyone in the game, not just me, will look at that person and say "Okay... why?" There's no other way for us to play. So when I saw it happening here, I did what I know to do best. I know that no one can have any info on me that paints me in a bad light because I targeted a living player in Night 1 who, as far as I know, has reported no ill-effects, and then I failed to do anything on Night 2.
I imagine it's quite a culture shock coming from somewhere that outlaws role-claiming to here where role-claiming is central to the playstyle.
Do you play with power roles? I'm curious as to whether the cop, for example, being unable to roleclaim, has to rely on parallel construction to make a case for a lynch if he finds mafia.
A slow start it was, with idle discussion
It soon became clear that nobody was rushin’.
When what to my wondering eyes should appear,
But a miniature sleigh and eight tiny reindeer.
That wasn’t all, though; I took in the sight
Of a silvery tube throwing flames thru the night.
I watched, mouth agape, as the ensemble landed.
A man then jumped out; he hadn’t come empty handed.
He threw his pack o’er his shoulder, then gave a great shout,
As something flashed by and cold knocked him out.
A great sled rushed by, pulled by three great white horses,
Their driver laughed as he guided their courses.
Again they rushed by, a second blow struck;
The man on the ground seemed quite out of luck.
A sound from behind made me draw in my head, I turned right around, found a man dressed in red.
His eyes - how they twinkled! His dimples: how merry,
His cheeks were like roses, his nose like a cherry;
He opened his mouth, but hadn’t yet spoke,
When yet another red glove then passed him a Coke.
I shook my head and sighed; such blantant branding!
All herky-jerky, another figure drew near,
Again dressed in red, with a little reindeer.
A harsh voice behind me: “Well you weren’t on my list,
But I dub you naughty! You must be dismissed!
You think a schnozz that glows is something? *whistle*
Just wait til you’re glowing from my nuclear missile!”
I shielded my eyes til the fission ceased,
But sadly another was quite clearly deceased.
Outside a funny man picked up a coat.
Put it on and his figure began to bloat,
Hair sprung from his face, he looked quite confused,
‘What can this baby do?’ he couldn’t help but muse.
This could be my night 1 target and I, supposing we're both Santas. The two Santas in this highlighted section seem uninvolved in the larger action of the write-up. It is tough to tell, as I've said, because there's 800 Santas here.
I imagine it's quite a culture shock coming from somewhere that outlaws role-claiming to here where role-claiming is central to the playstyle.
Do you play with power roles? I'm curious as to whether the cop, for example, being unable to roleclaim, has to rely on parallel construction to make a case for a lynch if he finds mafia.
We have tons of wacky power roles all the time, so the roles themselves aren't unfamiliar to me (some of the names/acronyms are though), but we also play with all the roles posted publicly by the game host most of the time, so if anyone role claims then it just becomes a game of "identify who has each role and check them off the list." We have to play by gathering information privately, if we have such a role, and bringing our suspicions to light in the thread. This is why I ask so many questions. The more information a person gives, the easier it will be to read and understand their motives.
I feel we are talking too much about me today and that is largely my own fault. I apologize for being a distraction. Who are you most suspicious of, adam?
well with a lead in like this, I'll start with my rainbow list.
Darkstone - green
Silver - green (This was orange last phase, but I really gave it a good thinking)
IR- yellow
Afrcngy - yellow
kj101 - yellow
Roy - yellow
Sloonei -yellow (Mostly town vibes, but I doubt he missed an action)
adam - yellow
JoH - orange (By default, i always never trust jack)
Quebbs - orange
MovingPictures - orange (75% scum)
Second,
Not sure how I set off some of your alarms here, but it's interesting nonetheless.
Third,
The suspicion on DB was BS and I was surprised to see it go as far as it did. I tried to help him out last night, but that didn't go as planned.
Fourth,
Vote: MovingPictures
I have no information, nor do I have an info gathering role. But, something twinged me oddly and I'm gonna go for it. I will, however, will move to Quebbster if that's where plurality will lie.
What's the "something" that twinged you about MP, darkstone?
We have tons of wacky power roles all the time, so the roles themselves aren't unfamiliar to me (some of the names/acronyms are though), but we also play with all the roles posted publicly by the game host most of the time, so if anyone role claims then it just becomes a game of "identify who has each role and check them off the list." We have to play by gathering information privately, if we have such a role, and bringing our suspicions to light in the thread. This is why I ask so many questions. The more information a person gives, the easier it will be to read and understand their motives.
I feel we are talking too much about me today and that is largely my own fault. I apologize for being a distraction. Who are you most suspicious of, adam?
I usually am pretty suspicious of quiet players. So there's a few this game that fall under that umbrella, but right now I'm most suspicious of Roy, who I felt like tried to buddy up to me with his tracking results. Buddying up to town is pretty typical mafia behavior.
Simple. I took awhile to write my post. I wanted to help silver with a pressure target since he gave us the SK. had he posted a vote before I began my reply, the vote would have been in the long post. In short, bad timing.
I usually am pretty suspicious of quiet players. So there's a few this game that fall under that umbrella, but right now I'm most suspicious of Roy, who I felt like tried to buddy up to me with his tracking results. Buddying up to town is pretty typical mafia behavior.
I also find myself most suspicious of Roy. Even in the light of this new understanding on how things work here, I still feel like the way he treated the suspicion against me was an opportunistic scum move, and the role discrepancy between him and Silver is looking like icing on the cake. I'm confident enough to put a vote on him now. vote RenegadeRoy