Actually the nightmare reapers are the best, but in that specified army he choosed to have them because of the flight, which now can be activated while in formation. The *** one has 2 clicks of 10 and then downgrading to 9, 9, 8, 6 in that point in a formation of 3 they'd have 13, 13, 12, 12, 9

On the defense side isn't that higher, but he got thoughness, and the movement in some way helps the defense because they canmove 24'' in 2 actions and then attack with the thirn action (asuming it is on the army pointed) so they didn't take any damage. Even if you click 3 of em for 3 (2 damage) they can take everything doing 4 damage next turn (6 pushing 1 of them and having an attack of 9 tho) so you have 4+6 damage on 2 turns (10 is a good number)

The damage is 4, 3 and then 2 wich isnt that bad for it point cost.

Just imagine the charging SA on the nightmares.. that's hillarous

That's just IMO

QUESTION???

DOES THE FORMATION CHARGE ,FLIGHT OR BOUND RULE FORM CONQUEST APPLY IN NORMAL MELEE GAMES. READING THE WARLORD RULES PACKET IT IMPLIES THAT IT IS A CONQUEST SPECIFIC RULE.

THANK THE HEAVENS YOU CANT FORMATION RAM!!!!

You can't Ram in formations.

I'm almost sure you can flight in formation.

I don't really think you can charge, bound in formation tho, can sum1 tell us?

Please stop writing all in caps.

And Conquest Rules are for Conquest only, not for "normal" MageKnight games.

General Stormfox

Yeah, but is true you can use flight in formations? or i'm wrong (i should be)?

ive heard nothing except you cant use flight in formation.

Flight still prevents figures from participating in a movement formation.

If you want to move figures with Flight in formation, you will have to turn off Flight, meaning you can no longer ignore intervening terrain or figure bases.

sellout23,

Conquest rules apply only to Conquest. For all intents and purposes, the Conquest rules sheet does not exist for Rebellion games and should be completely ignored.

101101001, I find Fell Reapers most effective as cleaners. Removing blockers and harassers, taking out wounded units, but not as a front line strike troop to walk up to a Stormy or a KI formation.

Pointwise, the ** Reaper is about the same as a *** centaur lt. - it is pretty good for its cost. No charge, but flight an toughness.

You have to admit, 2 or 3 of these on a major piece would not be nice, and they're mobile enough to do it.

101101001,

I find in many battles that tying up chargers is a prime way of gaining an advantage. This is most pronounced when that charger is a unique like a Thunderdom Troll, Orc Captain, GOM, Ulrick Charger, or Lancers LE like Elrodoon, as you are using just a fraction of the points the opponent committed to his big mounted fig to nullify the charge/bound threat of his pieces.

As far as other mounted uniques like Techun, Mountain King, etc., throwing a tough fell on their back arc after they have moved once makes them push for nothing or risk getting smacked for 4 damage (on a roll of 7 if they have an 18 defense),

With that toughness, the reapers have nothing to fear from ram or venom or polearm or shakeoff. It is a huge plus for the BigFig tie-up strategy.

Two tough fells can chew through a storm golem in no time at all...

Allright, Mr. Binary code, let's tackle this one, shall we? ;)

In addition to Juzam's and Jedi's comments (which are quite accurate!), I would like to add the following:

Fells are an awesome addition to just about any army, as they can serve as both a very potent harasser and anti-harasser.

First of all, 14" of flight. You can jump over terrain, you can start outside the range of any unit in the game and tie it up, and you can really mess with 12" ranged armies with this guy.

Example: Let's say my opponent is fielding a formation of 2 troll arties and a MP. I have a fell about 12&1/2 to 13 inches away. He moves them up, I fly to them, over them, and then behind them, touching into base with the back arc of one troll and the priestess.

What does he do? He cannot afford to ignore the threat, so he will have to free-spin the troll. Next he has to decide whether or not to push away a click of toughness to attack. If he does, the reaper takes 2 and hits back for 3. If he doesn't, the reaper hits for 4, producing an identical result.

All the while, other forces are free to slip to the side a bit and get outside the arc of the remaining troll, while still closing in to attack.

Yes, you can do the same thing with a shade, but I'm not a big fan of giving up free points, and you can't use a shade to tie up a heirophant, storm golem, thunder golem, creator, or striker.

What if you have an annoying magus, amazon queen, destroyer, magus drac, lich, anunub, chaos mage, or other MBing nasty hiding behind a wall?

No sweat. Reaper can fly in, OVER the wall, and tie him up too. Send in the cavalry right behind him, and go get you some.

What if you have an opponent playing a GA against you?

No sweat here either. The fell can follow him and base him wherever he chooses to run to. The first time he pushes to attack, you can move in with your other goodies. The first time he fails a breakaway roll, you nail him for 4.

Can you imagine what is likely to happen if I have a fell reaper, and you were foolish enough to push a unit within 14" of him?

I'd fly him right over there into BC with it, and while it was still a sitting duck, push to whack it for 4 clicks. :eek:

Bottom line, you don't EVER want to push a unit within 14" of one of these beauties, and if I can limit you from pushing just because of what might happen, then that one 43-point unit is dictating your actions for you.

True, this premise works for other units as well, particularly those who have a decent charge range, but IMO the fell is better suited to this with his flight; he can go over and around other opposing figures to keep himself from getting shot at while waiting to attack.

With 4 damage on his inital click, he can kill or demoralize goblin vols, * shades, * and ** skeletons, leech medics, grave robbers, shamans, * warrior sprites, imps... the list goes on and on. Anything 'soft', any kind of support troop, is not safe when one of these guys is lurking around the corner.

>>>Not to mention that if the Fell pushes to attack, I believe it loses toughness. In any case, I would like to know how these tough Fell Reapers will ever be able to use their 4 damage except by beating the odds. <<<

No, actually, the fell does not lose toughness if it pushes to attack. You're thinking of the nightmare reaper. The fell keeps his toughness for 3-4 clicks, and retains good mobility with flight for a long while.

Beating the odds? Nah, its not about that, IMO.

It's about forcing an opponent to push to react, pummeling weak support troops, sometimes tying up a 14" ranged unit so your other forces can move in safely, sometimes just hanging around and daring your opponent to push, sometimes using his base as a 'shield' to block LOF to friendly units, forcing ranged formations to spin the other way so they're not pointed at the rest of your army anymore, and just generally being an annoying pain in the arse.

I guess what I'm trying to get at, in experience, there are few times that I've actually managed to pull off that 4-damage hit. But its not always about what you do with it, more often its about what you force your opponent to do (or not to do) with it.

Despite the fact that my fells typically get chewed up in just about every battle I use them in, and they have, on the average, about a 50% survival rate, there has never been a game where I regretted dropping one in there.

They're just too versatile, too annoying, and too dangerous to ignore if one of them comes over to play. You generally have no choice but to react to whatever the fell is doing, if they are being played correctly.

Sending them straight into melee combat? Nah, that's a waste of their finesse. You would be better served with the nightmares or KI chargers for that, who would get first strike.

Flying them all around the periphery and finding a vulnerable spot to exploit? Yep. That's right up their alley.

Tell ya what, if this post doesn't convince you of their effectiveness, I'll give you one heck of a trade for the two you have remaining, and I'll even pay for postage. Sound like a good deal?

Carry On, Lads.
Hitman

Well said Hitman!

Can you have enough Fell Reapers? I just bought 4 more today in addition to the 4 I already had:D

Any other non-believers wishing to offload them can PM me at will.

The Reapers are the best anti-anti-thread IMO.

Why? Well, just read Hitman's post ;)

Hitman, couldnt agree more.

If I may comment quickly...

On the success of redundancy, I think it ought to be fairly obvious that this army ought to do well in many cases.

The reason as I see it is fairly simple. Assuming we follow the "archetype match-up" line of thought, let us consider an example. If I have an army with a stealth figure and you have an army with a magic blast figure, it is likely that you will kill my stealth figure, because, while stealth figures have an advantage over many others, MBers have an advantage over stealth. However, what hjappens if I have an army with twenty stealth figures, and you still only have one MBer? You may still have an advantage in a 1v1 matchup, but I have enough attacking power to kill the MBer, then use the advantage I have with stealth to destroy the remainder of the army.

In other words, while some redundant armies may face a threat from another metagame army, they can overcome the disadvantage if the opposing army is not entirely focused on their disadvantage. The sheer attacking power of nearly any 300 point army is great enough to eliminate one or two figures which normally would have had an advantage over the army.

In this way, a redundant army may have the upper hand over many other armies. If two players face eachother with swiss army knife type armies which are not redundant, it boils down to a metagame-based tit-for-tat: my MBer hits your stealth guy, my flier hits your MBer, your charger hits my flyer, etc. ad naseum. With a well-picked redundant army, you are likely to face only a few enemy figures that have any significant advantage, and these can be eliminated quickly and you can move on and press yoru advantage against the remainder of the opposing army.

That my .06 euros.

my take on redundancy: Its not that good an idea, nor is it gonna win you games. Sure a few successful armies lately have seemed to succceed because of "redundant" amounts of certain figs: Golempower's scorpem army, and Wkura's "tank" and any swarm or swarm/charge army. But if you look closely they are not really redundant. Sure they use a lot of one type of fig, but are supported to shore up any weaknesses they have. Also an important key to their success was that both were "rogue" army types (both in design, and figure selection) that could capatalize on opponents unfamialarity of the army. You will not achieve this by using 14 E@A in an army.
The reduction of weaknesses (bad match ups) is what makes an army successful. You are not going to succeed against a well designed 300 pt army by plopping down 7 fell reapers, or 10 troll arties. You will have some good match ups, and some really bad ones, just like all the rest of the mediocre armies lurking around.


my view on fell reapers:
fell reapers are only average quality figs. Sure they are flexible, but this alone does not make them worth playing. They are not that great of attackers unless picking on support figures, and they are too expensive to use as harrassers both in point costs and actions required. My opinion is that 9 out of 10 armies using them would be better served using the points for figures that are above average in quality.