Again... none of this helps the game itself. It just lines a few peoples pockets, and lets even fewer compete at the competitive stage (whatever form that stage may be).

In your opinion. We shall see how it all pans out, especially since we get a new OP framework and the schedule of releases on Monday.

haha, sorry Stu, this isn't opinion. It's basic logic.

If i make a game and 100 people love to play it... but i only print enough cards so that 10 of the people get the cards they really want, will the other 90 keep playing my game?

Basic law of supply and demand. Sure, not everyone can get a playset of every rare in every set. But when demand is there, you print more and keep most of the people happy, or at least working toward getting that supply. When it is cut short pretty early, and there is no indication of more supply being created.......

Just supply and demand. They needed to print WAY more MVL.

How does profit that UDE never seen help the game? Also, doesn't a high price in singles just go with card games? The secondary market price doesn't show how many people play the game. It just shows you what is high in demand. Stu just wants the secondary market to do well, since he seems to sell a lot of cards on ebay.

Yes, we've obviously underestimated the vast market of people who like to own cards and not play with them.

That, my friend, is a classic.

I am not trying to argue, I just remember the days of "The weak secondary market is the problem".

Looks like that logic was just opinion.

This place is a trip.

Ask erick, he used to argue the secondary market thing.

As I remember it, it was something about people buying more cards because they could resell them later or something.

I am not very good with logic.

Fact: People will pay anything for anything.

Hey, I'm all for the secondary market being healthy. It means all my cards may be WORTH something!

But a spike in card auctions with no reason on why it's spiking is subject to speculation. As we have no real facts as to why this is happening, as all the information about the new OP wasn't released til after this post was made. Of course stuff gets leaked but I doubt thats why.

That's what im talking about, people only want to buy more product to make more money. It helps in a way (i think they would sell the about same amount of product) towards UDE success, but the game really doesn't see much improvement. More money in the secondary market doesn't mean more people are playing.

Actually, it does mean people are playing.

Why?

Because tournaments=Packs.

Most basic tournaments have people playing for packs. $10, pack on entry, pack per head. If you happen to be a good player, you can generate a lot of packs, and thus, generate a some decent money.

If you are a bad player, hey, you bought a pack. Sure, you lost $5 but no big deal. Add turn that into a hobby league with participation prizes for added results. (Make it like $12 if you do that, to help pay back the cost of the HL kit).

Volia, people are playing, people have a reason to play, and product is moving. All this generated because of a secondary market.

Don't you know what every WoW player is thinking when they open a pack?

"I hope this is a Loot card/Epic..."

Sadly, we don't have any craftables or something like WoW does. Only a stupid myspace page for dolls. There should make it like...Comic book pages instead of crafting mats. Have a certain amount of issues, and boom, get a nifty card. Though, hopefully a GOOD card...

Tournaments =/= People playing

If tournament turnout is bad, which is usually true for recent vs tournaments, only a handful of people get the product. Also if only the same players are winning then only they are getting the product. And again just means a handful of people are selling and making a lot of money, but doesn't reflect the amount of people actually playing. The new OP and Galactus project is getting attention, but that has nothing to do with the secondary market.

A HEALTHY secondary market is good for a card game... don't misapply my posts.

In this case, as 13eye pointed out, 1 or 2 auctions for VS MVL singles at high prices isn't really an indicator of "healthy", but... it is a move in the right direction.

Multiple rares at $10 or higher is a good sign for a set, which MVL seems to have. People looking for these cards and online sites not readily having them is positive too.

But... it's not good enough until there are multiple auctions and onlines sites with a good supply of singles and the prices are still high, which means demand is enough for vendors to buy sealed product or buy singles from consumers who will buy more product. This is what sustaiins a strong primary sealed market and gets more stores to carry VS due to demand.

Theoretically.

It could have something to do with:

(a) Places reporting the sets are selling out. Whether or not the set is out of print or not doesn't matter ... people were saying it was out of print, so people may be reacting to that rumour

(b) There are more rares in the set, more stuff to collect, and it's harder to collect. All the stuff that people had been talking about for a long time. Just because the prices didn't START that high, didn't mean they wouldn't ramp up that high eventually. Many people predicted the format for Marvel Legends would eventually increase the value of the cards ... and it may have taken a while before it happened. Perhaps, because of the first point, with places selling out, people worried they wouldn't be able to get more boxes in, drafting/sealed decreasing as less boxes are around, the announcements of other Vs. products [the OP announcments weren't made, but they were announcing both Galactus and DC Legends, so they were confirming that they would continuing producing product for the game. All that mixes to a "maybe I should get the cards now instead of later.

In general, a high watermark doesn't mean you'll be able to sell more for the same price ... but people that WANT Marvel Legends are going to have to pay for it. Part of the equation may just be ... the only people that have purchased Marvel Legends are the people that wanted it for themselves. Consider the lack of secondary market. How many people would be profitting off opening boxes and selling off the rares/foils? With less people doing that, there is less available online, and more competition for it. The "bad" secondary market has in fact created a temporarily amazing secondary market because less people are selling since the only ones that have the stuff people want to buy, are also the people that want to buy the stuff ...

Whatever the reason, my auctions look fairly healthy with 4 hours to go.

I won't be able to check in here at the debate today until after work, if someone else wants to give the final totals for our little survey.