Okay, so I was trying to figure out exactly how many games of Mafia I've 'won' over the last 3 or so months I've played.

Do you count your 'wins' as ones that you're still alive at the end of, or if you 'team' wins?

Because if the only way to win is to still be alive at the end, then this does not recommend 'team' play. IE taking one for the team is great if you get a win because your team kills the last threat. However, if you get a win because you threw yourself on the grenade and your team then is able to pull out a victory that is a whole different kind of game.

So, how do you count?

If you're alive and fulfilled your win condition you won.

If you're just alive at the end without achieving your win condition, you lost.

If you're dead, you lost. Unless you won.

Team wins (for example, the Mafia winning, you're Mafia, but you died before they won) don't count. I mean, they can be moral victories, but they're not victory victories.

I win when I enjoy the game.

See me in Care Bears. That's not winning.

I think that Jack summed it up nicely.

In order to win, you must fulfill your win condition. In the cases of mafia and town, win conditions usually state that all of the threats to your faction need to have been removed from the game. In the case of neutrals, it varies. Finally, for some specific roles such as a jester or a bounty hunter, you don't necessarily have to be alive at the end of the game to achieve a win. (And I also agree that regardless of your faction, you don't necessarily count a win if your faction achieved its win condition after you were removed from the game.)

On a personal note, I have never kept track of wins/losses. I prefer to remember great roles and awesome game moments rather than to keep score.

Like Quebbs, I write my own win conditions. It makes the game more fun. Don't succumb to the pressure of competition. play to have fun, nto to win. It takes the game to a whole new level of complexity.

Well, the reason I brought up this thread was because I had been thinking to myself that I'd be doing pretty well and had one fairly often. Then, when we had no games open, I noticed the # of posts count next to the thread, which led me to start looking at, did I win or lose when I had X number of posts. Was there a correlation? Then I started looking at correlation between # of posts and being Mafia or not. Then I started doing analysis on that (all strictly for fun, so I guess I was winning And then it just kinda snow balled from there.

And what I noticed was, I only ACTUALLY was alive at the end in my first two games. And while since then, my team has won several times, I myself was never alive. Hence the consideration for what is the win condition....

It is very interesting for me, that of the 4 answer so far we've had two that were the letter of the rule (be alive when there are no other threats) and 2 that were, play for fun. However, no one has said, you win if your team wins...

hmm

Indeed. Frankly, Rokk has the wins sewn up so completely I don't even worry about it. I just go out and try to have some fun. Preferably I like to roleplay it out (see Carlos' Star Trek) and see how long I can last with that.

Okay, RAW is that you win if you're alive and you won, or if you have some sort of role that basically says, "You leave the game and you win", or somehow credits you with a win regardless of your living or not.

Honestly, win conditions exist to motivate players to play a certain way in the interest of game balance.

To answer your question, I'd say that I "Win" when my team wins, regardless of whether I'm alive. Though I have a lot of other conditions for myself for "Winning."

Well, it has been stated that team wins are not really a win for everyone on the team (unless you happen to be alive at the end of the game.)

So... if I am mafia and I get killed off but the mafia wins the game, that does not mean that I get a win. The implicit part of any win condition is "you have to be alive at the end of the game" whevener you are town, mafia, or neutral cult.

(Believe me, I've had only one player ever disagree and argue to the contrary. The truth is that you can't coast to a win with the team if you died along the way. Them's mafia rules for ya....)

I win when I can frustrate Darq...

Hey, if to you winning is when your team wins, then by all means, that's a win. In fact, I think that would be a great new standard for a win and one that would make the game a whole lot less confrontational and aggressive. It would encourage team play and people not being such sorebutts all the time about getting killed/lynched.

And while we're on it who the heck are Jackasterston or StevenStrawlkowalakowski to tell you what a win should or shouldn't be? You decide that for yourself man. It's just a game have fun. It doesn't matter how many wins you have in the long run.

We're all building sand castles anyways... You can't take any of it with you.

Technically, you don't get listed as a winner unless you meet your win condition and are alive. Bodyguards are the one exception I can think of. They win if they die protecting someone of their own faction and that faction goes on to win the game.

My point is that it doesn't matter how often you win. If you are happy with your play, had fun, and helped your team, the scoreboard is irrelevant.

Hmm, you know my brother? Odd.

Really? I've never done it this way. I like that idea, though.

I've never seen that happen before. Every time I'm a bodyguard and I die protecting someone and they win the game...I still lose. It's very frustrating to get that role for me.

Winning for me is more of a team game when you are mafia. Some mafias could not win if certain play wasn't made by dying players. Main game I'm thinking of is TMNT99's No Man's Land. The mafia's play in that perfectly set up the last surviving member(Shadow40) to be utterly brilliant and get through the game. That's a team win to me.

Silly Lantern. You got the name wrong.

It's StanSpudowski.

And don't you even think about grabbing his mop away from him.