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Is it possible to Carry Spiral and still treat her Gateway Markers as adjacent for movement? Would Spiral being "off the map" while being carried cause her trait to be ignored until that movement ends?
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DIMENSIONAL PORTAL: Give Spiral a double power action, remove all Gateway markers from the map and place 2 Gateway markers on the map. Place one in an adjacent square and the other may be placed in any square on the map. Friendly characters may treat squares with Gateway markers as adjacent to each other for movement purposes.
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Rulebook - Under Powers and Abilities
Game effects remain a part of the game only as long as the character continues to possess the power or ability. If a power or ability is countered or lost, all game effects of that power or ability immediately end, but any actions already in progress are resolved normally.
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Players Guide - under CARRY
Characters being carried are not considered to be on the map for any game effect.
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CARRY
When moving as a result of being given an action, this character may carry one friendly character. When this ability is used, modify this character’s speed value by –2 until the end of the action. The following characters can’t be carried: larger characters, multi-based characters, characters holding an object, and characters with any of the following combat symbols: , , , , . To be carried, the friendly character must be adjacent to this character at the beginning of this character’s action. When this character ends its movement for the action, the carried character must be placed in a square adjacent to this character. While being carried, a carried character is not adjacent to any other character, nor can it draw a line of fire until placed at the end of this character’s movement for the action. A character which has been carried this turn can’t be given an action (other than a free action) until the beginning of the next
turn.
Battle Map Removal
Characters that are removed from the battle map are not affected by any game effects and may not use their own game effects except as stipulated by the effect removing them from the map.
I can see this being read in different ways.
One could say that the figure is off the map, but then one could also argue that being considered to be not on the map is not the same as being off the map. (Yeah, I know that sounds silly, but this game has some rigid rules when it comes to terminology.)
With all of THAT said, I know that things such as Barrier remain on the map and keep their properties while the Barrier-ing figure is carried. I would see this acting no differently.
One could say that the figure is off the map, but then one could also argue that being considered to be not on the map is not the same as being off the map. (Yeah, I know that sounds silly, but this game has some rigid rules when it comes to terminology.)
With all of THAT said, I know that things such as Barrier remain on the map and keep their properties while the Barrier-ing figure is carried. I would see this acting no differently.
Yeah, but those powers and this one are not countered or lost when the character gets carried, they are just ignored until the move is finished.
unless I am reading it incorrectly the power indicates that the token must be placed adjacent but it doesn't state that she must remain adjacent, so after placing the token she should be able to be carried
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DIMENSIONAL PORTAL: Give Spiral a double power action, remove all Gateway markers from the map and place 2 Gateway markers on the map. Place one in an adjacent square and the other may be placed in any square on the map. Friendly characters may treat squares with Gateway markers as adjacent to each other for movement purposes.
unless I am reading it incorrectly the power indicates that the token must be placed adjacent but it doesn't state that she must remain adjacent, so after placing the token she should be able to be carried
I don't think there's any question about her needing to stay adjacent. The question is "if she's off the map because she's being carried, does that prevent Dimensional Portal from working?"
I can explain it to you, but I can't understand it for you.
“No matter how subtle the wizard, a knife between the shoulder blades will seriously cramp his style.”
The power says the token must be placed in an adjacent square but it is neither stated nor implied that she must remain adjacent. Considerbarrier witha zero range character, the barrier tokens are placed adjacent but then if they are moved the tokens aren't removed, only if the creating character looses the power or if the tokens are destroyed.
Her power places the object but then it appears to work independant of her. Consider superman enemy as an example, it used to state that continued adjacency was required. There is no mention of this in spiral's power.
Consider also that the new SE ta doesn't require continued adjacency only initial adjacency
Last edited by Adam_Warlock; 09/15/2013 at 11:30..
"Friendly characters may treat squares with Gateway markers as adjacent to each other for movement purposes."
If that part of Spiral's ability is inactive when she's off the map, then the person carrying her may not treat squares with Gateway markers as if they were adjacent. And, therefore, the person carrying her could not travel through the Gateway.
Ok but that is a reference to the gateway markers. Spiral creates these just like robin creates smoke cloud or green lantern creates barrier tokens and once the tokens are on the map they impact the field in specific ways but aren't affected by the movement of the creating character unless specified. Once again, continued adjacency is neither stated nor implied.
Ok but that is a reference to the gateway markers. Spiral creates these just like robin creates smoke cloud or green lantern creates barrier tokens and once the tokens are on the map they impact the field in specific ways but aren't affected by the movement of the creating character unless specified. Once again, continued adjacency is neither stated nor implied.
Adjacency is not the issue, no one has said it is other than you.
The question is if this line of her trait applies to the portals while she can't use powers. Friendly characters may treat squares with Gateway markers as adjacent to each other for movement purposes.
Yes however there is no reason to assume that the gateway markers wouldn't work independant of her. If I put up a smoke cloud and then do a ranged hypersonic attack against a character in smoke while carrying the fig which initially laid down the cloud, the effects of thesmoke cloud would not disappear. This is an unlikely scenario admittedly but I think it is valid.
Battle Map Removal
Characters that are removed from the battle map are not affected by any game effects and may not use their own game effects except as stipulated by the effect removing them from the map.
I can see this being read in different ways.
One could say that the figure is off the map, but then one could also argue that being considered to be not on the map is not the same as being off the map. (Yeah, I know that sounds silly, but this game has some rigid rules when it comes to terminology.)
With all of THAT said, I know that things such as Barrier remain on the map and keep their properties while the Barrier-ing figure is carried. I would see this acting no differently.
Add to that this from the Player's Guide:
Powers/Abilities
...
- A game effect which states that another game effect can‘t be used prevents a new activation of that specified game effect, but it does not end any ongoing effects unless otherwise noted.
She would need to lose the trait while being carried for the portals to be unusable. If being carried simple equals she can't use the trait, then the ongoing portal effects are still in play.
Yes, the trait only allows her to create the portals and indicates where the first one must be, the portals themselves do the work so removing her from the map wouldn't affect them, just the loss of her power via outwit or ko would do it the same as barriers aren't removed if you carry the creating figure (and yes, I know you currently cannot outwit traits but I am sure that is coming.)
You have two characters adjacent, one with perplex the other with . You perplex the character with 's movement up from 10 to 11. The carries the other character, what is his movement?
Spiral's portal will still be in effect.
Quote : Originally Posted by Necromagus
When I came on board as RA I brought with me a mission to meet the intent of a power/ability and a firm distaste for exploits or loopholes that circumvented the intention of a rule. That's where the Rules team comes in.