I have been playing MWDA casually with some friends for some time now, and have developed a set of house rules that I believe are remarkable effective- without unbalancing the game, or adding more tedious calculations.

However, my friends and I know each other's playing styles very well, and we may be hiding some issues that our rules create becuase our style does not surface them.

So I am asking the group for some input on the positives and negatives of our rules.

PLEASE DO NOT SUGGEST NEW ONES!

We are looking for a critique of existing concepts, trying to prove them out (or disprove them) before making adjustments.

Here they are:
1- All units disembarking from a transport have a both their attack and defense values reduced by two on the round they disembark.

2- Add the following to the ECM rules. All artillery attacks within the weapons range of a unit with ECM subtract 4 from their die rolls. For mechs, you use the lesser of the two ranges listed.

3- Replace the heat rules with the following:
a. Walking does not add or subtract heat
b. Venting removes all order tokens from a mech
c. Running generates 1 heat
d. Jumping generates 1 heat
e. All attacks generate 1 heat
f. Charge attacks require both a run, and a ranged attack, thus generating 2 heat.
g. A mech may make 1 ranged combat attack with each weapon system per turn, but each one generates 1 heat.

4- Since charging now includes a ranged attack, range for a charge must be measured center dot to center dot.

Constructive feedback and discourse is most welcome.

Here is an update:

Rule #1 proved too cumbersome to keep track of. We left the transport rules as they were.

Rule #2 proved to be quite interesting. We did tone it down to a -2, as -4 caused entirely too much havoc to drifts. It allowed cheaper units (like Shandra scout vehicles) to act as escorts for more expensive ones. It did hinder artillery somewhat, but not overpowered it.

Rule #3 works great. It slowed many mechs to a walk and made them much more powerful.

Rule #4 works well too, but did not limit charging too much.

We added rule #5:
All running is made at 1.5X base move, not 2X base move.

This works very well to reduce charging, and made all of my fellow CBT players happy too.

With these changes, even the dreaded artillery/vtol/meat shield army is combatable. Mechs are much more useful and not so easily countered. But they still can be slowed by infantry and harassed by artillery.

Let me know what you think.

Rule 3.b looks alittle over powered right off, but I suppose it balances out since firing generates heat even if you have no order tokens, and venting still ties up an order. Kudos for finding a way to use both weapons systems in one turn, and still keep it balanced.

About the ECM thing, maybe it should be "the lowest non-zero range value measured in a 360 degree arc" not just the "weapons range". Even with this, artillery could probably still overpower your environment... if you guys played that way I mean.

All in all good job. I look forward to reading what others think.

Using this heat system I assume no heat is generated for "pushing" (i.e. giving a mech an order when it already has an order token). Otherwise walking while pushing would indeed generate heat. While firing both weapon systems on a push would generate 3 heat. One for the push and 1 for each weapon system. right? That seems like alot of heat so thats why I assume "no heat for pushing".

So, basically order tokens on a mech are meaningless because the mech will generate heat based on what it does now - this turn, durring this order - and not whether it has an order token from last turn, correct? If this is so then 3.b is meaningless unless it is refering to the ordertokens on a shut down mech, but I'm pretty sure 3.b doesn't mean that mechs automatically restart when given a vent order. At least I hope not.

Maybe you could explain this part alittle more clearly. I think I know what you mean, and I want to try it out because on paper it looks to be more fun than the current heat rules. I just want to make sure that I have your concept down correctly in my mind, and that any loop holes are closed.

Thanks

When you give a mech a ranged combat order it gets to fire both of its weapon systems if it wants to right? It just takes a heat for each system fired durring that order, ok I got that.

But...

Do you A) fire one system then take the heat and roll for heat effects before firing the other system then take the second heat and possible effects - OR- B) do you take both shots then take all the heat at once (i.e. afterwards)?

And if B above then...

Do you A) make one attack roll for both weapon systems and then compare it to the targeted units' defenses one at a time (the way you would if a single weapon system fired at multiple targets) -OR- B) make a separate roll for each weapon system against its respective targets.

Again, this all sounds like alot of fun, but if you could clarify these points for me before I take these rules to test in my play group.

Thanks

El Heffe,

You are right. Item 3B is essentially meaningless. Giving a vent order is the same as it is now. You have to not move or fire, and issue the order to vent.

As far as weapons fire, each weapon system has to be rolled seperately. The reason for this is largely due to mechs with multiple targets on one system and widely varying ranges between the systems. If you rolled one roll, it would be difficult to keep track of all of the targets. Also, it plays into the idea that massed weapons fire would be trickier to control than a single shot. Thus you need two rolls.

Additionally, from both CBT and the video games, there is a tendency to 'play your shots'. For instance, I unload my PPCs on the target. If I hit, I probably will maneuver for my next shot and let my mech cool. If I miss, I may choose to get off another quick shot and risk the heat rather than loose the firing position.

As for the ECM, my group could not find a unit with ECM that had a range of zero. But you did bring up a good point about it needing to be a 360 degree arc of effect. We tacitly played that way, but we should state it.

Thank you for your input. I also recommend Warflail's home rules thread also.

The "non-zero" bit was in case an ECM unit had melee for one of its weapon systems. If you just said the shortest max range and some body had melee ... well ... you get it.

also you forgot to answer about the pushing generating a heat. I'm assuming that my assumption was correct. Perhaps 3.b could be changed to read: "All heat generation is EXACTLY as described below. Mechs with an order token on them do not take any additional clicks of heat when given an order."

Thanks


P.S. I'm gonna' search for Warflails rules now. ;)

Here are my revised rules, that my group is playtesting right now. They combine much of Warflail's ideas, as well as several others.

Changes to Artillery rules:

1) Artillery gets +2 attack for clear line of sight, not +4.
2) When each pog is placed, it must be declared either a direct attack or an area bombardment.
3) Direct Artillery attack rules;
3a. 3D6 are rolled, and added to the attackers attack value. Any additional bonus or penalties are applied. Drift is calculated, and units affected are determined. This attack value is compared to the defense of each unit in the blast radius. Any targeted unit with a defense value higher than the attack roll does not take damage. All units with defense lower than the attack roll takes the damage listed.
3b. Point defense, camoflague, decoy, and evade will be applicable against artillery direct attacks only.
3c.Hindering Terrain does not block line of site to a target of a direct artillery attack, nor does it add to the target’s defense.
3d. Elevated terrain adds +1 to defense of units targeted by an artillery direct attack. Elevated terrain is considered to block line of site to attacks that are placed on the terrain.
3e. Direct attacks against VTOLS at cruising follow the same rules as above. Crusing VTOLS gain the benefit of the +1 for elevation.
4) Area Bombardment rules:
4a. Pogs indicated as an area bombardment cannot use ANY ballistic SE listed on the dial. 3D6 are rolled, and added to the attackers attack value. Any additional bonus or penalties are applied. Drift is calculated, and units affected are determined. All affected units take the damage listed.
4b. Point defense, camoflague, decoy, and evade do not affect an area bombardment attack.
4c. Hindering terrain reduces the damage done by an artillery area attack by one, to a minimum of 1, to any unitsin hindering terrain. Hindering terrain does not interfere with line of site.
4d. Elevated terrain is considered to block line of site to attacks that are placeon the terrain.
4e. VTOLS at cruising are affected by area bombardment. They do not gain any height advantage modifiers.
5) ECM affects artillery in the following manner. All artillery attacks within the weapons range of a unit with ECM subtract 2 from their die rolls. For mechs, you use the lesser of the two ranges listed.

Changes to Transport rules:

1) Units disembarking from a transport are given an order token. This token does not prevent them from taking an action on the turn they disembark. If a disembarking unit acts on the round it disembarks, it must push to do so, and take 1 click of pushing damage.
2) Units must dismbark from a transport immediately if that transport becomes salvaged. Units disembarking from a salavaged transport take 2 clicks of damage to do so.
3) Units in base contact with an opposing unit may board a transport if the transport is given a move order. Both the transport and based units must make a break away roll to accomplish the boarding.

Changes to the special equipment cards:

1) Armor Piercing: Armor piercing ignores all defense special equipment except decoy.
2) ECM: This unit cannot be the target of an indirect fire ranged attack. Units with streak missiles cannot target units with ECM. Units with Improved targeting cannot use this SE to target units with ECM. ECM increases the difficulty to hit for artillery attacks by +2.
3) Pulse: Units with pulse deal full energy attack damage to infantry units.

Changes to the Captured units rules
1) Captured units cannot be the target of any attack. They can take damage from direct or area bombardment artillery attacks.

Changes to the movement rules:
1) When a mech is given a run order, it may move up to one and one-half its listed movement rate.

Changes to the mech heat rules:
1) Walking does not add or subtract heat
2) Running generates 1 heat
3) Using Jump jets SE generates 1 heat. You cannot run and jump in the same turn.
4) All attacks generate 1 heat
5) Charge attacks require both a run, and a ranged attack, thus generating 2 heat.
6) A mech may make 1 ranged combat attack with each weapon system per turn, but each one generates 1 heat.
7) Pushing does not generate 1 click of heat. Mechs which do not take an action on a given round gain 1 click of cooling.

Changes to the ranged combat attack rules.
1) A mech may make 1 ranged combat attack with each weapon system per turn, but each one generates 1 heat. Each weapon system must make an individual attack roll.
2) A vehicle may make a ranged combat attack roll against a unit basing it. If that unit is inside of the vehicles minimum range, its defense value is increased by 3. The vehicle must still be able to trace a line of fire through its front arc.

Changes to the Charging Rules:
1) Range for a charge must be measured center dot to center dot, as charging implies using weapons in addition to a physical attack.


let me know

UPDATE:

These have been working pretty well. The minimum range for vehicle rule is a little cumbersome - however.

We have been discussing allowing the use of streaks to target unit in base contact with friendly units.

Since the advent of artillery, streak units have rapidly diminished in utility. This may bring them back,.

Here is my latest changes.

The artillery rules have changed dramatically, and I think they are pretty good.

Changes to Artillery rules:
1) Artillery units always use the attack value listed on the pog. There is no penalty or bonus for line of sight on artillery attacks.
2) When an artillery attack is declared, the artillery unit is given an order token and its pog or pogs are placed. At the beginning of your next turn and before the artillery tokens are resolved, a play may use an order to activate any optional Special Equipment (SE) the firing unit may have. A second token is placed on the artillery unit. Then the player resolves the attack by rolling 3 six-sided dice and adding the firer’s attack value as a normal attack. The placing of a second token uses an order, but does not incur the 1 click of damage for a push. It corresponds to a normal push in every other way; that is, a unit that used a SE cannot be ‘pushed’ to fire in the next turn.
3) At the beginning of a turn on which an artillery token will be resolved, any units with the word “Scout” in their name may be given a Range Combat Order. This ranged combat order adds 2 to the dice roll when resolving the artillery attack. The “Scout” unit must have line of sight to the center dot of the artillery marker and the distance must not exceed the Scout unit’s ranged combat value. A maximum of 2 units with scout in their name may be given orders in this fashion per artillery attack. Thus, if two artillery attacks were resolving in one round, a player could expend a maximum of 2 orders per attack, or 4 orders total. When using multiple pog artillery, only the pog within the ‘scout’ units ranged combat value gain the benefit of their targeting.
4) Hindering terrain reduces the damage done by an artillery area attack by one, to a minimum of 1, to any units in hindering terrain.
5) ECM affects artillery in the following manner. All artillery pogs within the weapons range of a unit with ECM subtract 3 from their die rolls. For mechs, you use the lesser, non-zero range, of the two ranges listed.

Changes to Transport rules:
1) Units disembarking from a transport are given an order token. This token does not prevent them from taking an action on the turn they disembark. If a disembarking unit acts on the round it disembarks, it must push to do so, and take 1 click of pushing damage.
2) Units must dismbark from a transport immediately if that transport becomes salvaged. Units disembarking from a salavaged transport take 1 click of damage to do so.
3) Units in base contact with an opposing unit may board a transport if the transport is given a move order. The unit in base contact must make a break away roll to do so, but this does not count as an order.
Changes to the special equipment cards:
1) Armor Piercing: Armor piercing ignores all defense special equipment except decoy.
2) ECM: This unit cannot be the target of an indirect fire ranged attack. Units with streak missiles cannot target units with ECM. Units with Improved targeting cannot use this ability to target units with ECM. ECM increases the difficulty to hit for artillery attacks by 3.
3) Pulse: Units with pulse deal full energy attack damage to infantry units. If this unit is a mech, it takes 1 click of heat to do so, but does not need to roll a second attack roll.
4) Streak: Units with streak missiles ignore base contact rules when determining targets. They can fire into and out of base contact.
Changes to the Captured units rules
1) Captured units cannot be the target of any direct ranged, close combat, or special attack. They can take damage from direct or area bombardment artillery attacks.
Changes to the movement rules:
1) When a mech is given a run order, it may move up to one and one-half its listed movement rate.
Changes to the mech heat rules:
1) Walking does not add or subtract heat
2) Pushing does not generate heat.
3) Running generates 1 heat
4) Using Jump jets SE generates 1 heat. You cannot run and jump in the same turn.
5) All attacks generate 1 heat
6) Charge attacks require both a run, and a ranged attack, thus generating 2 heat.
7) Doing nothing removes 1 heat
8) Starting and ending a turn in water removes 1 heat.
9) Venting removes removes the vent rating in heat.
Changes to the ranged combat attack rules.
1) A vehicle may make a ranged combat attack roll against a unit basing it. If that unit is inside of the vehicles minimum range, its defense value is increased by 3. The vehicle must still be able to trace a line of fire through its front arc.
Changes to the Charging Rules:
1) Range for a charge must be measured center dot to center dot, as charging implies using weapons in addition to a physical attack.