[Homer Simpson]"Mmmm... bologne..."[/Homer Simpson]


Homer, it's a tank.


[Homer Simpson]"D'oh!"[/Homer Simpson]


Yeah. D'oh. That about sums them up.

-= Lunatic

Well, it's better than the Tokugawa (Davion) and the JES III (All of 'em). Why did they reprint 2 bad to marginal units? I don't get the motivation.

Because Wizkids needs a few units to take up space in boosters as opposed to being good... :nervous:

All ths talk of the Bellonas and Jes IIIs being bad and worthless is making me super, super mad. I like theses units, they are neat to have, and just because they are not the equivalent of a DI Schmitt or even a Joust does not make them only worth the satisfaction of chucking into the garbage bin. They have their uses, just not many.

What?? No pics??
Come on Draddog, throw use a few pics.
Is it the same sculpt or have you guys change the weapon with the damage type?

Very usefull low cost harasser/anti-infantry units.

Oh, i agree! I enjoy all units because i like to look at them, I would get bored of 5 House Kurita stylized mechs in a row if i only bought singles. As it is, the booster smattering of units that i got is a nice mix of pretty much every sculpt, if not every peice.

My one real gripe is NO PICTURES
thats my favorite part of the entire sneak peaks Wizkids! I do not care for meta gaming before or after a set is released, however i am interested in the sculpt, and whether or not it is new.

Well, here`s some more cruddy piece to add to the pile... :ermm: At least they didn`t give Kurita one of these, lol. :p

Why use the JES III and Belona vehicles again? Because even WizKids' staff would laugh themselves silly if they re-issued the VV1 Ranger.

It's the Cizin's little sibling.

Well, the Liao one isn't COMPLETE trash...it's a little supporting tank to hang out with infantry.

They're not absolutely stellar, but they aren't as useless as the bulk of the JES remakes. Put these in as formation help that can bite a little, maybe.

These new Bellonas are ok, but not great. I really don't like the BR one, though. I would've actually preferred a reprint; trading 5 clicks of evade for a starting DV 1 point higher and 3 clicks of heavy armor, was a bad trade, IMO. The new one also costs 2 points more. I don't like to be negative, but, I REALLY hate the BR Bellona's paintjob. Anyway, until retirement hits, I'll just keep using my Regulator IIs. And after, I'll use our awesome Cizin instead. Frankly, I'm feeling fairly disappointed in Annhilation.

It's not so much that they aren't very good (or one could say "competitive"), but one can't help but get the feeling that they're taking the place in a booster of something that actually COULD be good/competitive.

If I could guarantee that I only pulled one of each rank, I would, because I do wish to collect a complete set. After the first one of each rank, though, my heart's going to sink every time I pull another of that rank, because I've already GOT the one I need for my set, and I really don't need any more to PLAY with. This is one of the kinds of units that sees the majority of its play in sealed games. Now, I do LOVE sealed games, and I quite enjoy taking what I get from my boosters and "whipping them into shape" into a coherent, effective fighting force (so to speak :) ). (My sealed ranking is quite high, and better than my other rankings.)

After my first dozen or two boosters of each set, though, I'm disinclined to buy more boosters because the liklihood of getting units that are worthwhile in multiples goes way down. At that point I tend to turn to eBay, to try to complete my set (after exhausting trading with other local players). So if I could even guarantee that when I bought some boosters I would get pieces that weren't "competitive," but were at least pieces I didn't own, then I'd still buy boosters.

This is where the problem of a tank like this, or the JES III, comes in. Once I've got one of each, if it's not "competitive," I don't want to see any more in my boosters. If it IS "competitive," not only do I want one of each to complete my set, I don't mind at all pulling more than one.

Maybe the solution is to give some kind of game bonuses to formations composed only of identical vehicles. One would have to make sure that it didn't make the ones that were already competitive into monsters, though...

Perhaps something like allowing a firing formation of identical vehicles to extend their range, or damage, or both. Limit it so that the primary attacker can't extend their range, but the secondary units can. Or maybe the primary attacker gets a +2" range extension, to a maximum of 14". Then all of the secondary units can reach as far as the primary attacker (they must still be within arc). Maybe make that a maximum of 4", so they have to stay bunched up, rather than spread nose-to-tail. Add +1 damage for every two secondary units. This would really help cheaper units that do 2 or 3 damage, but not help as much the more expensive units that already do 4+ damage. Then, just perhaps, allow formations of identical vehicles to be given "assault" orders: 1/2 move then shoot, and the target gets +1 to defense. These changes wouldn't affect artillery much (as long as the "assualt" order specified "ranged combat attack," so artillery attacks couldn't be made), and they wouldn't affect VTOLs at all (no formations).

With these rules additions your typical formation of three of these Bellonas would cost 105 to 123 points, have an "assault" range of 15" (or 17" if adding +2"), an effective 12 attack (9 + 4 - 1), and do 4 damage ballistic. That's comparable to a light 'Mech in cost and assault range, with a little more damage.

Perhaps another modification could be that they automatically get a second token after doing an "assault" (like a 'Mech gets an extra heat), but only take push damage if they already had tokens. This would make the tank formation "assault" an attack that you have to think hard about, strategically, to take, because your units are going to be very vulnerable after you give them that order.

Also, their combined "clicks before salvage" would be 18, which is more than double a typical light 'Mech, but after doing one of these tank "assault" orders an artillery shell is likely to take twice as many clicks off of them as off a single light 'Mech, since they're bunched up in formation.

Opinions?

-= Lunatic

Contrary to what some people think, I actually am happy to see the little Bologne tank back. The Davion one is actually not to bad. Its only 37 points, and has decoy.

This is basically a completely average unit. I don't see that it is remarkably good or bad. I can see uses for it but it doesn't scream out that it is a game-breaking piece.

With the negativity in this thread concerning these new hovertanks, I can't understand why these have 4 and 5 stars a piece... :surprised :ermm:

I'm not going to say they are garbage but really, I can't see them worth more than 3 stars just like the JES III just doesn't seem like it could possibly go more than 2 stars...

Oh well, guess we have threads covering that.

Cheers

Hear, hear! That's exactly how I feel. Junk units in general are a waste, because they'll never get used, and they take up space in sets. If we weren't getting the horrible JES IIIs, or the "blah" Belonna Tanks, we could be getting vehicles that were actually worth using! What I will never understand, is how Wizkids lets these things get made? How could they have thought that us players, would want new versions of a vehicle, (the JES II) that sucked the day it came out in FFE? Or that it really had a role to fill on the battlefield, besides artillery bait, 'mech bait, and saving them cash by using old molds? Why on Earth, must there always be crappy figures in every set? Why can't Wizkids, and TOPPS, be more like Wizards of the Coast, and make all their miniatures usable?