The Rabbidgerbal just read the relic that was posted, it's a book that is held in a staff and slows movement while protecting against most ranged attacks.

Well with the newer advanced rules addressing so much between terrains and very specific types of attacks, is Mage Knight making the final transformation into full blow games wrokshop warhammer fantasy/40k mixed?

The Frothing One isn't saying it's bad, although perfers a more streamlined game. It just seems like they are taking the final steps at exact direct challenges to warhammer. The relics are great examples of it.

WHat are your thoughts?

In a sense, it might be moving closer, but i don't think it'll ever be a true comparison. A challenge to it, as you said, perhaps. But they are too different, in other ways than game mechanics that is.

MK is random in its packaging, more eyecatching for those that enjoy the thrill of the pull, and for collectors. Rarity is a big deal. In Warhammer, you can get anything you want, straight off the market.

Directly related is price. While you could end up spending a great deal on MK...you don't have to. For Warhammer, i'd have to save up and spend lots of money at once. I could just grab a booster of MK every now and then as i see fit and my wallet allows.

A third thing. I personally don't have much skill repainting, modding, or building. Do i really have to support this further?:p

I know this isn't exactly what you were asking, but i thought it merited saying and remembering.

in short MK 2.0 is warhammer wishing what it should have been. ;)

Peace,
master Gunmix

I think so, and I do think its bad. MK has always marketed itself as a simpler faster game that the fans love for its fun and total cool factor. MK is about to lose all that as it becomes a "new game" way more inline with warhammer, e.t.c.

Having said that, I'm still playing my 1.0 armies and have just begun mixing it up a bit by playin dungeons as well.

As for 2.0 - I'll still by a starter and some boosters to try it out. Heck - I am a big fan. But we'll see how that goes. If MK has become everything I hated about the bigger more hardcore fantasy games than I might just have to live in the past and stick with the original.

My 2c - try it and see how we go...

The Direct corrilation in the Rabbidgerbal's eyes started when the relics really hit him.

In warhammer 40k you have relics and wargear that can be assigned to the heavy hitters.

as time goes on the rules seem to becoming closer and closer to direct games workshop.

The Frothing One admits that there are still differences in the prepainted and the randomization but some of the other elements of the game are becoming strikingly close.

The Rabbidgerbal remembers reading a story some long time back about the creator of wizkids mage knight developing the game of mage knight after being frustrated with the package of games workshops game. It just seems ironic that as time goes on that he's emulating more and more of it.

I think they had to make the game a little more complex to keep their player base a little more consistant.
I know of a lot of players where Mage Knight was their first miniatures game. They felt that while Mage Knight was fun it was too basic and once they played it a while it got boring too fast.

A lot of those players moved onto Warhammer, Warmachine, etc.

By making Mage Knight more complex and with more variables you will keep your player base more consistant and won't have as much turnover.

It is good that they are adapting the game. I know I am eager to buy the booster when they hit the stores next week.
Xanathon

Mage Knight will always be easier to play and learn than War Hammer for two simple reasons:

1. Everything is based on standard 6 sided dice.

2. Combat dial. Nuf said.

you forgot one other thing whitelancer.....

MK weighs less.....

*Sweeps all his mk into a cardboard box* Example one

*sweeps all of someones fully painted 40k army into a box and has to flee the angry player now bent on killing him* Example two.

Basing just Relics and items as a correlation that this game is moving to Warhammer is a little farfetched.

Every fantasy genre on the face of the planet has powerful artifacts that people fight to claim, which grant ultimate powers or ultimate curses. Let's see, we got a One Ring, we have a foehammer, we have banners of power, we have necklaces of power, we have amulets, sharp pointy rocks... etc.

MK is becoming a better fantasy game, if nothing else.

.

HA! ...... sad.....but definitely true.

example 3. twisting base on MK figures....good idea.

example 4. twisting the base on a 40K figure....Bad idea.

Example 5: MK Player: "Dude! 22 inches of range! That's broken!!!!"

Example 6: "Can you get the tape measure please? This yard stick isn't long enough."

Some thoughts:

MK1 was simpler than MK2, but part of that is because the game is maturing. Most players demand more complexity from a game, as they get better. This drives change.

This isn't as much of a problem, because WK has HC and CF, so they have new "intro to minis" games.

On the other hand, MK is differentiated from WarHammer due to GW's marketting model. GW insists that WarHammer is a hobby unto itself. Namely, it consists of painting, modelling, and playing. GW sells the whole lifecycle of the game.

Just because MK has relics, domains and other funky bits, it still should be lighter and easier to digest, because its all compact. Warhammer requires a lot of looking things up in books for stats and the like (granted, some people memorize this stuff) but it is still a lot. They also change the scene up of what's compatible (just like Magic does), forcing the consumer to buy new stuff because the old stuff is not allowed.

Compared top MK2, that's a big deal. Some people think compatible means "just as good" There's no guarrantee that your MK1 figs will be better or worse. WK admittedly tried to make sure they still work well. And by compatible, they mean you can keep using them. That is a lot better than complete banning of all old figures.

Janx

If Warhammer came with assembeled and painted figures, I would say yes. Since it does not, and the hobby aspect is almost more important than the game aspect, I will have to say no.

I think the frothing one is comparing the actual gameplay experience of the two. I have no way to make that comparison as I have never played Warhammer. I have seen it played a good bit and have lightly scanned the rules.

2.0 is more complex, there is no doubt. I like it much better. I hope it attracts alot more players, but the age level of the players will be higher than what 1.0 attracted.

It is a different game based on the old game.