i apologize in advance for those of you who just want to see the army and move on. i think explanation is an essential part of army design and reporting, so i am going to do it here. anyways....

...i'm sitting around bored one nite, and i'm thinking about the army. i decided to break it down a bit, to cover all my bases, (no pun intended) and figure out what i believed would be strong. i do this for two reasons:

1. i wanna know what pieces will work well.
2. i wanna know what pieces i will likely be facing.

so, i'm thinking that aquatic is gonna be strong. center token is totally surrounded by water, so DUH! secondly, if i wanna stop the center token from being sealed before i have a chance to get to it, i don't have time to run around the water, i gotta go through it or over it. i'm also thinking that flying/soaring is gonna be good. hopping over the water or the blocking terrain is just as good as walking through it and we all know the nifty power of the EF sky dragons. what's that? i'm most likely to be playing some EF people and they are required to have EF figures in their army?
BONUS for them. so i gotta be prepared for that...

my primary way of winning the game is by controlling objectives, and really the whole board, or by killing off all my opponents figures. i need some serious action advantage to keep time in my favor, and i need some killing machines.

i also think that range is important. first strike capability is awesome, and no domains to worry about screwing over my ranged pieces = gotta have atleast a little range. even better, if i can get a couple of good pieces that can serve double duty... enter Kierin Starsdawn with Silvercloud.

*pauses for people reading this to stop laughing*

Kierin is perfect here for me. he has good range and damage, and we gotta kill quick. he has bound, so we can work around all the blocking terrain without wasting actions or time. then silvercloud on top of that! who cares about those silly EF dragons now? ok, i do, but not nearly as much... he's in!

now, about that aquatic. its definitely essential, but what do we have any good choices? that's right, my dear friend the DC salamander. why him? 4 good reasons:

1. he's DC, fits the theme and scenario perfectly.
2. mounted charge gives me even more action advantage.
3. he's tough! 18 defense with terrify is nothing to yelp at and his 20 defense in water! WOW! best of all, i know there is gonna be water in the scenario, so there is no reason i shouldn't be able to take advantage of it.
4. i just got one, and i'm dying to use it:)

so, knowing we are using the salamander to contest the center objective, and others if need be, we need a good hitter to ride him. i'd even prefer someone who hits REAL hard, or atleast has the potential to do so. check out the * DC Barrow Knight. he can ride my salamander, he fits my theme really well, he's not horribly expensive. weapon mastery allows him to try and hit the quick kill/massive damage, he can even regenerate himself to stay around longer. him staying around longer means i'm contesting tokens longer. heck, his +3 rider bonus gives him good chances for overwhelming. he's a keeper!

sticking with our theme of tagging/contesting tokens and major action advantage, who do we use for bodyguarding/distraction? 2 *** Zombie Centaurs. i can dig that! i shouldn't have to tell you about the awesome abilities they contain. action advantage, double time for free, long dials, good attack and damage, fit my theme, and can do auto damage!

toss in a little * Blood Shaman for some healing/hexing. he can also do some ranged support, and he can soar, which we have already established works great in this scenario.

12 points left over. i go with * Orc Marauder. can't use subfaction abilities, but that's ok. he is still great for tagging tokens, blocking line of sight, tying up figures, or helping with gang-ups. besides, he's 12 points, what do you expect for 12 points?

so here it is folks:

Kierin Starsdawn - 77
Silvercloud - 27
DC Salamander - 50
* Barrow Knight - 36
2 *** Zombie Centaur - 32 each (64 Total)
* Orc Marauder - 12

300 Exactly!

Please post some replies and let me know what you guys think.

A couple of things:

1. I really like the use of the centaurs(duh), but why the *** versions? Downgrade at least one, but I'd prefer both to the ** versions because the quickness will help you out a lot, but moreso it saves you 8 points. That 8 points goes towards upgrading that marauder to a *** at 20 points, which is much, much more intimidating with the reckless.

2. Kieren w/silvercloud seems like a good idea. I know I'm using one EF sky dragon, but I'm also using the tough flame priestess, which has a much better range than kieren, and can push without consequence. It'll be pretty easy to wait to attack Kieren with the sky dragon until after Kieren moves, making him have to push to attack back, I like where you're going with this, but I might add in a little more range support.

3. Keeping the awesomeness of dragon priests and flame priestesses in mind, I might be persuaded to try to include some magic immune type figures in my army, this is just a personal preference.

4. Weapon Mastery on a rider is just as bad as weapon mastery on a figure with three or more damage, which is to say not good. Impale does not work with weapon mastery, so I would also reconsider the figure possibly for a figure with range, I have no idea if there is a good range figure that can ride the salamander, so if there isn't, just ignore this.

Of course this is all just what I think, which is what you asked for. :)

you're right! this is the exact kind of feedback i enjoy. well thought out, explained well, backed-up with examples, no flaming or insulting. i'll take that anyday! more more more!!!

however, upgrading the orc will do very little for me. apoc. side can't use subfaction abilities, so reckless does me no good.

:D

Lego

sorry for double posting...

i forgot to add the * blood shaman at the end of my first post. the army in question should be:

Kierin Starsdawn - 77
Silvercloud - 27
DC Salamander - 50
* Barrow Knight - 36
2 *** Zombie Centaur - 32 each (64 Total)
* Blood Shaman - 34
* Orc Marauder - 12

300 Exactly!

Folds, I don't think that it matters that Kierin can be outranged by a Flame Priestess, as long as the Blood Shaman is positioned right, he can just heal Kierin if you hit and then Kierin can smack back, and with Silvercloud you won't like it, you'd have to stay on the ground..which would open up the Salamander to attack.

I don't mind getting shot first if I know I have the healing to come back from it...

I'd rather have Rava and a Blood Shaman than a Vithzerai, Vitz outranges Rava, hits him for 4 (5-1 for Lurk), then if Blood Shaman heals Rava even decently Vitz is done for...

oops, I do agree with "dwongrading" the Centaurs and upgrading the Marauder though! :)

here's a variant, based on Folds' suggestions:

Kierin Starsdawn - 77
Silvercloud - 27
DC Salamander - 50
1 * Scalesworn Honorguard - 34
1 * Zombie Centaur - 24
1 * Blood Shaman - 34
1 ** Vampire Archer - 41
1 * Orc Marauder - 12

299 Exactly!

in this version, i still have Keirin with silvercloud for anti soaring, along with the Vampire archer doing the requested Ranged support. the Blood Shaman could do some ranged support or healing/hexing as jgklaw pointed out. also as requested, the barrow knight was moved to the scalesworn honorguard for more consistant damage, 4 total that is. the orc marauder is still doing the same job as above, and the * zombie centaur is doing the same bodyguarding/distraction. six units to move, so 3 on each turn works. questions, comments, solutions? whatcha think guys?

Lego

:D

ps - thanks for the ideas/suggestions so far!

wuts up with this apoc. side thing i havent been able to see the scenarios for tournaments so could somebody please tell wut its all about
like wuts the scenario and special rules and stuff

The player who controls the most objectives at the end of the game wins.

Army Size: 300-point armies; three actions per turn. No titans or multiple-dial warriors are allowed. One player represents the combined Elemental/Revolutionaries army; he or she must have at least five warriors from either the Elemental Freehold or Revolutionary factions in his or her army to begin the game. The other player represents the warriors of the Apocalypse; he or she can choose warriors from any faction to build his or her army.

Time Limit: 50 minutes

Rules Set: Mage Knight, Dark Riders

Preparing the Battlefield: No terrain features or castle sections are placed. Place the center objective token as indicated by the black dot. Place the other two objective tokens normally.

Special Rules:

Lords of Apocalypse: The Apocalypse player’s warriors gain the Apocalypse faction symbol instead of their faction and/or
subfaction symbols; they can create formations of between three and ten members. The Apocalypse player’s warriors cannot capture other warriors. This special rule cannot be canceled by any domain.

Defenders of the Land: All the Elemental/Revolutionary player’s warriors that are from either the Elemental Freeholds or Black Powder Revolutionaries faction can create formations with each other.

Sealing the Temple: The Elemental/Revolutionaries player can permanently control (seal) an objective. To do this, he or she gives a special action to a warrior that has no action tokens and that started the turn in base contact with the objective token. If the objective is contested, it cannot be sealed. Once an objective is sealed, note it with a token. If all of the Elemental/Revolutionaries player’s warriors are eliminated, the Apocalypse player automatically wins, no matter how many objectives are sealed.

the map is a 3x3 map, with 6 "H" terrain pieces and 2 "L" terrain pieces. 3 of the "H" pieces are along with left, 3 on the right, both "L" pieces are in the middle. incase you don't know, "H" is blocking terrain, "L" is aquatic.

hope this helps...

Lego

thanks alot and by sealed does it mean that the apoc. team cant control once its been sealed

yup

Lego

i disagree with fold's idea of upgrading the marauder... you see, if you side with the apocalypse, all faction AND subfactions are ignored. therefore, no reckless, lurk, revenant, etc... so why bother with the tough marauder right? just remember: no subfactions for the apocalypse! good luck with your army!

Yeah, it's ironic that I've been constantly thinking that we have a scenario were revenant is highly unlikely in any game, and I forget that reckless is a subfaction ability, I apologize for my dopiness!

I was trying to figure out why you liked the **Vampire archer over a different range piece, but that 12 inch range is pretty nice. The range damage is a little weak though, and arcing fire is a waste of points on him considering he could just soar to get the same effect.

Personally I'd rather have something like a khamsin arty. Any of the three ranks would be really good as cheap range support, but I may actually be tempted to put in a *Khamsin Arty because of the stormfire. I'm sure you're going to be seeing cavalry units, and stormfire packs a nice extra punch to their attacks, that and it's cheap.

That'll give you 17 extra points, which gives you a lot to work with. One option would be to put in another *Orc Maruader and then upgrade the Zombie Centaur to a **, giving you still enough actions to move your whole army in two turns without formations, which is fun.

But a really good thing would be to add magestone bracers to kieren. This boosts his defense very well, and gives him great protection against the big cavalry bound with spell resistance. That would leave you 7 points, which you could use to upgrade as you think is wise.

Hope that helps!

Let's think about this one...

Kierin Starsdawn - 77
Silvercloud - 27
Magestone Bracers - 10
DC Salamander - 50
1 * Scalesworn Honorguard - 34
1 * Zombie Centaur - 24
1 * Blood Shaman - 34
1 * Combat Magus - 30
1 * Orc Marauder - 12

298 points

6 units, to maximize actions per turn. ranged support by the combat magus, including the recommended stormfire. last, but not least, magestone bracers coming in for some added protection, (my personal favorite change, great idea there Folds!).

What say you...?!?!?!?!

Lego

ps - i'm loving the comments....thanks so much guys...:p

Looks good to me, hope you do well!