I came across the following little blurb on another games related website. The poster in question is a game store owner who attended the recent GAMA Expo and was reporting back on things he'd seen/heard at that convention. I can't comment on the reliability of the original poster or the accuracy of the info, but I thought it worth sharing.

"Wizkids - is struggling with Pirates, HorrorClix, and Mechwarrior. Horrorclix will only get new stuff when licenses are obtained from popular horror properties. Although Mechwarrior is planned to get a movie in the future, the game is in jeopardy. Because of this, a new ordering technique may be implemented. Basically, it will be like GMT's P500 system. Retailers will be integrated somehow though. They don't want MW to die, but something radical needs to be introduced [they do have plans for a MW movie]. And Pirates sales have slowed down a lot, not to the point of jeopardy, but marketing changes are in order. Heroclix interest is going stronger than expected."

For those unfamiliar with it, GMT is a hex-n-counters historical wargame company. The P500 program (which they started but many other small game companies now use) is a system a game manufacturer can use to minimize their financial risk in developing new products.

When the company has a game nearing completion, they estimate how much the game will retail for and add it their P500 listings on their website. The P500 listed game is assigned a (roughly) 20%-30% discounted price for anyone who orders the game before the Charge Date (see below). The company then tracks the number of orders for each game.

Once a game is on the P500 list, customers decide whether they want the game. If they do, they then order it by credit card, and the company adds their names to a list of buyers. Buyers are basically committing themselves to buy the unfinished game once it gets produced. The company does NOT charge your credit card when you sign up. When the game reaches 500 buyers, the company goes into final preparation for production. Then when the game is ready (usually when there are about 700-750 orders), the company announces a Charge Date (the date they actually charge your credit card for the game). They aim to ship the game in 12 weeks or less from that Charge Date, but occasionally some products take longer -- the company has to keep the buyers advised of the status of production.

If for some reason the company doesn't get 500 interested gamers to commit to purchasing the game within a set timeframe (typically about a year from the date the game is first announced), they cancel the game and drop it from their P500 list. Prospective buyers aren't charged anything for games that get dropped.

I've used P500 programs with several game companies in the past and have had no problems. Of course, with the smaller game companies that typically use P500 programs, trust is an integral part of the process -- the companies go out of their way to communicate with the buyers and keep them fully informed on the status the the project. That, unfortunately, is something that WK doesn't have a particularly good record with doing, which has implications about the success of any P500 style program they might start.

How Wizkids would implement such a program, particularly one that directly involves retailers, I don't know (nobody else has run a P500 program that way before as far as I know). I suspect that you'd have to place your pre-order through your local venue, rather than directly with WK. Given that many local game stores are already on relatively shaky financial ground (particularly with the current state of the economy), having them assume the bulk of the risk here strikes me as a not particularly bright move. But I'm not a business major, so what the heck do I know...?

Anyway, the nice thing is that this suggests that WK may be exploring ways of keeping the MW product line alive -- assuming WK follows through on the idea. I won't hold my breath, but I'm certainly interested in seeing what comes of all this.

Interesting thought. Not sure it would work as a collectable idea, but it has potential.

Of course, many of use a jaded/cynical enough to wait for it to come out and get reviewed before we spend money on it.

Yeah, I can't see it working with sealed boosters. "Pay in advance for something that you don't know exactly what you're going to get" doesn't strike me as a particularly sound business model -- I sure as heck wouldn't sign up for something like that. But for an Action Pack format product, it might work well.

It would certainly be a good way to try and market faction oriented sets: they could propose (for example) a "House Kurita Action Pack" with certain pre-determined units in it and let people sign up for it. If there are enough Kurita fans (and general collectors), then they can "safely" manufacture the set, knowing in advance they'll make a profit off of it; if not, they don't have to go forward with production (and can probably safely assume that they can start easing HK out of the storyline/production cycle since there aren't enough interested players in that particular faction).

But, like I said in my opening paragraph of the original post, I've no way of being certain whether WK intends to go forward with a P500 program or not. But it is an interesting idea...

This would be a great system for getting the Solaris Champions pack made - finally. But how long would we have to wait on it, while WK sets the system up, I wonder?

I'd be interested but they need to let us know what we're buying ahead of time. IE I want to know the STATS. I preordered a pair of wolf spider packs and I was disappointed.

That's a good point. Some would still buy it as collectors, but if it's shat they won't.

As loets them quality control for possible broken combinations and abilites. They could almost playtest the peices before release, and just change the paper on the dial if it becomes broken. That is a good way to stop or greatly reduce the power creep.

I don't think that's a good idea (at least from WK's perspective of generating sales, or from the perspective of the metagame). They could/should certainly give us "teasers" which hint at the more notable features which units in a set are going to have, but giving providing the complete stats in advance would almost ensure the program would be a failure.

Too many players would simply look over the stats, come to the conclusion that units X and Y from proposed Action Pack #3, and unit Z from Action Pack #5 are the "good" ones -- then those sets would quickly become the only sets that got fully subscribed. As a result, in very short order, you'd end up with out of control stat creep as the only way to get buyers to P500 a set in advance would be to keep making the units look better than what was in the previous set.

As the game moves out of a "competitive" environment (i.e. no more prize support), WK has to find a way to maintain interest in the game, to keep us coming back to play at the venues week after week. That means they'll pretty much have to move away from relying on stat inflation to generate excitement over new releases. Why? Because if your opponent keeps playing the latest "uber-piece" that they got out of a P500 Action Pack, you can just go buy that same "uber-piece" too (for essentially the same price they did).

The stat inflation paradigm worked in a sealed booster environment because it was difficult for everyone to obtain the latest "uber-piece." SAD may have been frustrating to play against, but typically only one or two players in a locality were lucky enough to pull that combo from their boosters or could afford to buy it off the secondary market. So armies were either built around SAD, or built specifically to counter SAD. But in an Action Pack only environment (which is what we're probably going to be transitioning to if they go the P500 route), everyone has the same access to the latest "uber-pieces." That means you rapidly end up with cookie cutter armies -- everyone playing essentially the same thing. That's boring -- and it'll result in players leaving what will have become a boring game.

I second everthing Clown said, plus wanted to add this point: releasing stats of the units will really hurt sales.

For example, when the Nova Cat pack is up for consideration, all the Nova Cat fanboys will go ahead and agree to buy it. But the Nova Cats are a middle-of-the-pack faction in terms of player support - so this pack will also need approval from competitive players. But if they look at the stats, and say "Nothing in there matches SAD/Refuge/whatever", then you lose votes. And you need votes to get the pack made at all.

Sealed booster sales were generated by people taking a risk - you bet $10 on the chance that you pull something you want. If you don't, you supported the company. If you do, then the $10 was well worth it. In the case of this business model, WK will need the fan base to take a risk on each action pack, and agree to purchase without stats - just like in the days of sealed boosters - in order to generate enough sales. The Nova Cat players, by themselves, surely can't continue the line - if all of us together weren't managing it before.

That's assuming they go with factioned action packs.

For all we know they could keep trying the mercenary route (which many people are quick to tell you how sick of them they are [least on-line]).

So if mercs are out and the fans of one faction cannot support the game that begs the questions "what will they do?"

Multi-faction packs? So now it's hopping you can get two fan groups in, and they don't go "hey, let's split it"

Personally I think they have some prospects, like a poly-factioned boxed set. I going on no prior experience to know what's feesible but it would stand to be something that's moderetly priced and includes several factions in it. Say for example it included 4 factions: Clan Wolf, Republic of the Sphere, Bannson's Raiders, and House Liao. Each faction would get 4 infantry, 2 vehicles, and 2 mechs. Depending on how funding goes they would either be the same 2 vehicles, mechs, and infantry among the factions (but with the respective dial forumals) or different ones.

Another thing would be "historical battle" action packs. Coming complete with a scenario to recreate some of the key battles in MechWarrior history.

Then there is also a mini-booster set. Small amount of figures, covers all the factions, and what the P500 does is take orders on "cases "of them. The set is small enough that 1 "case" contains 1 of every piece.

P500 at the venue level not the player level could work as it is essentially the same risk venues take now but with a longer lead in time. Venues with more player demand will pre order more while those without any won't have to bother with it. Considering I don't think Diamond/Alliance is going to change it's minimum purchase requirements it will make little difference on the consumer end of things.

It's sort of like Wendy's or Jack in the Box(?), They don't make it until you order it. Sort of lazy on Wizkids end of things, as it requires no market research or advertising. The real question will be, where will those savings go? Certainly not back into our pockets, but will we get better playtesting? Will we get well thought out units and only slightly skewed combo's?

Dogan
Something tells me it'll be earmarked as profit, but thats my bad attitude.

That really isn't a bad thing. Considering if it is earmarked as profit then they'd be more likely to keep things in the MW line going. I hope something comes of all this.

Some interesting thoughts on this P500 thing. Wizkids cannot go with single Faction packs because enough players do not support any one Faction with the exception of ROTS to sell 500. I like Mechsae’s idea about multi-faction packs and historical “scenario” packs. Those are awesome ideas to sell 500 packs to the whole community. The pieces need to be mostly “common” to encourage players to buy multiple packs. We also need the stats a head of time especially after the stats on the Wolf Spiders pack. More play testing is a must as well……….

This has been a very interesting turn of events. I for one am excited to see that we may be getting more pieces in the future!!!!!

So WK now wants the venues (which they just let go) to hold all the risk?
I can see players splitting the cost on a booster case, they already do that anyways. Would they really try to go a format that you basically need to showcase the product. Unless the change the game mechanics, I do not see this going to smoothly for WK.
Why would they stop the current distribution? I would have fired the executives long ago.
I'm glad to see positive news, but I'm cautious due to the stupidity and timing. Waiting this long to say your going to use someone else's plan? I know GAMA is the place to implement change and create excitement but this hardly does either.

I'd get behind it. But as a player based P500. Don't make me go down to a venue and pre-order it. The yahoo behind the counter may charge me before it's made. The owner (yahoo's boss) may not know anything about it. As it is I get a discount on buying WK/MW stuff, but only if the owner is there. I would just be afriad oflack of comm. Not only from WK but with venue owner to employees to me. Ever play the phone game? All intel is changed by the time it gets to the end.

As to what to get, I'd hope they do action packs like the Phantom War. A couple Uniques, but most of it is nons. Repete sales if it's good. As it was the PW set got me into the CHH. As most everyone else, my funds have limited so I can't afford everything. I'd pick and choose what I'd want. Don't expect me to order HD or HL sets. But if it had anything HS or HK I'd get one. 2 or more if I liked it.

Keeping intrest of the game in stores would also be vital.
Some stock in the stores would be need. Blind boosters? A long run base set? (have the company that makes the stuff signed up for more than 1 print run) Or even booster packs of CECs. I don't know what WK could do.

But I have this idea.
Another possiblity would be to have a Venue or store only P500. A pack of a Mech or a few. Some support units. Overall good stuff. If the store ordered so much (active player tourny base) they would get a prize kit. Very much like the WS call to arms kit. A store could order a case of the VenueOnlyP500 and get an LE version of the kit. This could be sold or given away in a tournament.
A prime exsample would be the Archer. Have the Archer with support units, rules, & SE card (would a ruler/dice even be necca? save the $$ WK). Older players would get it for the Archer. New players would have every thing needed to play. Stores would have prize to give away at major tourny. Would that be anythig but win-win-win?

I think this P500 could work for WK (I know it would work for MW). But I see it working if they keep communications open, offer P500 to players (and the players would have to know there is a chance something won't get made), and offer something for stores to sell/keep intrest alive.

I think the history with the Wolf Spiders Pack goes to show two things...
1. A single difference in a stat can make a huge difference in how players see a unit. If the ranges had been longer, or the cost cheaper, or the heat dials better, people would have loved these units, even if only one of these had been implemented. No one complains about the Vulture, because of the better heat dial, nor the Thor due to the range
2. WK game designers doesn't really understand what people want. Would I have bought the Solaris Campaign Pack, maybe but only for the Archer and the Malice and the Arbalest, not for the Hachetman or the Firestarter or the Legionare, I just don't want them, no matter the stats, no matter what kind of ultra special ability they would have. And for every person who thinks like me there is another person who only wants those units. But lets face it the main draw is the Archer, if it was given out as a prize would you buy the pack? I would dare say 80% of players would not.

Lets look at the P500 system, you want me to buy something you haven't made that might or might not have what I want, with stats I can't see until you send them out, from a company that has a terrible track record of giving out information about there own product even now. They haven't been honest and forthwith about products there were releasing, and now all of a sudden they are going to change. I want MW to continue as you do, but the being on life support is not the way to go, better to die and remember the good days and make our own figures than that. Once bitten twice shy, I'll have to pass on that one.