Somehow this had slipped my mind, most likely so that I wouldn't be tempted to scream.

During the 10k at pcsf, which was sealed, for those that didn't know, the player that registered the cards I'd start the day with made gross errors on their deck list.

After calling judges over upwards of 8 times to correct mistakes, the judges were becoming irritated with me, though I was doing my job.

I point out a series of errors to the judge and she takes my deck list, initials and asks if i'm done, to which i reply 'no, i need to mark off detective chimp. she hands me back my paper and i check off detective chimp, and hand her back the deck list, since time has been called, but as i said, my deck registrar made a ton of mistakes. So, it is round 4-5 i believe when my game is interupted for a random deck check.

no biggie, since I don't cheat.

Or so I thought.

I am called away after having my deck returned, only to be asked about the errors on my deck list. I point out the initialing all over the paper where the judges signed off on errors.

The head judge says that my list only shows 68 cards. I say no, it shows 70 cards, I showed the judges earlier where the mistakes were made. I show him on the paper where I even shoed her the mistakes...but find that she didn't correct it at all actually. Instead, she removed the card that I showed her wasn't there, but failed to mark the card that was. I show the head judge where and how the lady judge had made her mistake, but that doesn't satify him. I insist that the other judges be brought in immediately to confirm that I had indeed called them to correct these mistakes, but he shuts me down. He points out how there were mulitple numbers in side of single boxes, another error pointed out to the judges and i had been told it was fine, as the number had been written over.

This ordeal had now delayed my game by almost 15 minutes. The head judge then says that I should return to my seat and continue my game while they discuss what to do about this.

WHAT TO DO ABOUT THIS??!!!

I followed the rules, and showed the judges what mistakes that I hadn't even made, and the player that screwed up the deck list was in no trouble at all, while I was about to face a dq over some bull ####!

So the judge interrupts my game again to inform me that I would be recieving a warning for not making the judges correct the mistake. WHAT THE ####!!!??!?!!

Ok, so I challenge the warning pointing out that I did nothing wrong, and have a ton of witnesses including the judges that can confirm that I showed these errors to the judges repeatedly.

He says that I should make sure they correct it in the future.

I almost lost it right then and there.

I tell him that with us about to open our new packs that I will have no choice but to be a dick if there is anything wrong, because I am not getting DQ'ed over some other idiot's lack of ability to follow directions.

Once more, my registrar made a bunch of mistakes, listing cards incorrectly, too many of a card, and the like. I irritate one of the judges, a guy I know, this time, with my repeated needs to keep calling him over and what ever judge I could find. I made each judge stand there and fix the mistake while I watched, and initial each instance. I called for a judge each time I found an error to ensure that i didn't overlook anything.

The 10k finishes with me in a 6/3 for 31st place.

So, now that you know what happened, was I in the wrong for being demanding of judges? I tried to not be rude, though honestly, my frustration was showing.

But with my 30.00 and a dq on the line, I couldn't risk some jackass costing me anything.

What are your thoughts?

ok, if you paid attention to the anouncements made before the 10k started, the head judge for the 10K said to find all mistakes before calling a judge over. that is the reason that the judges were getting irritated at you (i wasnt judging, but a friend was and i think i heard about you)

Even without the head judge's announcement, it seems odd that you'd have to call a judge more than 3 times, even with that many mistakes. It sounds like several sides have faults. Being concise with the mistake correction would've been helpful, I'm sure. I'm surprised there's no penalty for the person doing the initial check making that many errors. At that point, it seems almost pointless to have the initial check. The judges could have handled the original corrections better too, though it is tough making a solid judgement on their stance, since the only info we've got is that of another party. I'd just say in the future to keep the correction calls to as few as needed.

well, there is no excuse for the head judge to be an ass, but if it tok you more than 2 judge call, when you knew that there were going to be mistakes, I think you could have given it a more thourough look when you got your decklist. the registrar is just an idiot. and that's my 3 cents(cuz 2 just aint enough)

The procedure we practise for our events is, following the deck swap, we instruct all players to first put thier name on the decklist they just received, and to check that all cards have been correctly registered; where to call for a judge immidiately if there are any mistakes.

Whenever a player calls us over and claims a card has been mis-registered, we first have him complete checking and make sure there are no other mistakes (and/or to find all other mistakes). We then take the decklist and the said cards to the player who registered the deck to confirm if they actually saw those cards during registration, and if they made a mistake in registration.

Various possibilities may take place at this junction. One of which is we may give the player who registered the deck a warning if necessarry.

Also, before collecting decklists from the players (and before the deck swap), we remind (and actually make...) all players add and write the totals at the bottom of each column on the decklist. This totally eliminates any != 70 cards registered problems.

I'm sorry to say, but when you call over the judge, make sure you know as much as you can as to what is wrong,

However, I definitely have gone over sealed lists before and first with the player, then the one who registered it. these things need to be done. It shouldn't totally be the players fault if you end up looking at 68 cards registered. both players would be at fault. And if the player actually brought this to your attention, then is should only be the fault of the one registering the deck.

I find it hard that the female judge didn't 'man up' and say, 'yes i did deal with him earlier'. something about this is fishy to start off. with. I mean as a judge, if i had to deal with a player that had already been an issue with a faulty decklist, I'd keep the details handy.

Nothing cheeses me off more than poor card registration in sealed. When I first learned to play this game and did my first sealed trourney, the head judge was very clear about how to register the cards. You HAD to put them in sheet order, no hash marks, fold the sheet around the cards and rubberband around the sheet.

Now being that this was my first trourney I figured this is how it went everywhere. It make checking the registration easy and there were few errors.

Then I started going to tourneys in a new area and the head judge wasn't as strict. Sure, mine were still in sheet order and such. But man, the first time I got a set not in order with hash marks, I just thought "What Tha F***" It just takes twice as long to check the cards and if there are errors folks who just threw the cards in a pile are alot more apt to say.. "Eh.. yeah.. I think that was in there" And worse folks are less likely to check the cards at all and just start deck building when they see that they'll have to hunt for card checks.

Sorry, off soapbox now. Thats just something that always bothered me was sloppy deck registration. Especially when the head judge lets it slide.

I've always thought that warnings should be given for improperly registered deck lists and unsorted sealed product. It's so annoying just to get all the cards in a random pile, especially after the judge has said to sort them in order. And how hard is that really? They're all right there on the sheet. No thinking required!

Heck I've got a warning for just registering the wrong version of a character. My mistake, warnings fair, I hate it when peaple don't put the darn thing in order.

Well I was the female judge he is talking about since I was the only one working PC. First thing I want to say is that I was never asked about the situation during the event so there is nothing for me to own up to.I was not asked about it even after you wanted judges asked about it. From your intial post several judges should have been asked about your list and I dont know who was asked and who was not.. Second, I did by your own words ask you if you were finished and you said no. I returned your sheet for you to finish. You then gave me the sheet back, at the point it was your responsibilty to make sure it was correct. Lastly,there was a team of people who checked deck lists and yours must have gotten through the intial check made on all lists.

There were several errors on many of the lists that players filled out for 10K. Ultimately players are responsible for the lists not judges. When registering decks you need to find all errors then call over one judge to fix them all at once. Judges should not be marking sheets only intialing mistakes or corrections.

Players need to make sure they follow directions and are careful when registering sealed product. It helps the events to proceed smoothly and prevents things like this from happening to other players whose are not at fault.

PLayers need to take responsibility for making sure when errors are corrected they take note of the corrections with the judges. Judges can make mistakes.

Also, out of your own mouth, you did not follow instructions and called a judge over repeatedly instead of circling errors and correcting them all at once. In a 200 man event it's hard to deal with people when players are not following concise instructions.
Also as a judge it's hard to have too much sympathy for a player when they get upset that they're getting a warning but they're doing so after not following instructions. Respect is a two-way street.

Also, lets take a look at what the end result was: A Warning to you which is somewhat meaningless for a lot of deck reg errors, though I agree that the person registering your deck was probably most of the fault.

This is the one huge problem with Vs. Ever since we've gone to one game matches the penalty system is a little out of whack.

Giving warnings for deck reg errors of a somewhat serious magnitude is silly. The only way people really pay attention for the future is game losses.

Spare the rod, spoil the child. Give out game losses, let a player whimper once and they won't make the mistake again.

I got screwed over at the PCSF 10k by the head judge as well.

In my third game on turn four I went to lay my resource and my opponent and I suddenly realized that I had forgotten to lay a resource the previous turn. He calls a judge which isn't any big deal since we had both drawn for the fourth turn and it would not be quite so easy to repair the game state. I figured, though, since we were both at fault for missing it, we'd each just get a warning.

Instead, the head judge says I can keep my three drop, but I'm NOT ALLOWED TO HAVE A THIRD RESOURCE! I'm now forced to play behind my opponent's curve for the rest of the game, and of course he absolutely decimates me.

Jesus Christ, why didn't he just give me a game loss. Yes, it's my own fault for forgetting to lay the resource, but this is a 10K - how is there any semblance of competition in a situation like that?

Actually, the correct penalty WOULD be a game loss.

A whole turn passes, you have drawn new cards, that's an unfixable game-state, a procedural error major, and you should have gotten a game loss.

This is doubly true if you played a 3 drop with only 2 resources.

You weren't screwed over, you actually got a gift by being allowed to continue playing at all.

Both players are responsible for the game state. They'd likely both get a game loss. (in the correctible version where no new cards are drawn, *both* get a warning)

Double game losses are very rarely handed out, though. I'd be surprised if that was done in this case.

The opponent would certainly get a warning for missing the illegal recruit, though, which I didn't bother to mention, since everyone knows both players are responcible for the game state.